Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Steven Carr · 07-02-2013, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephan huller

I can't believe anyone would manufacture something so easily spotted as an alleged fake like this. There must be another explanation.

1) Time machine

2) Now I'm out of ideas....

Toto · 07-02-2013, 01:11 PM

There's an app that syncs Outlook with Gmail.

Toto · 07-02-2013, 01:20 PM

And you can see that Joel Watts has revealed his email address (which I was asked to removed, and did), which is not a gmail address - at suddenlink.net.

But that time clock at the top right hand corner is a puzzlement. And all of the other screen shots do show "connected to gmail."

stephan huller · 07-02-2013, 01:21 PM

it is a puzzle

Steven Carr · 07-02-2013, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

I don't think the email program, whatever it is, would put the message into the sent folder unless it was actually sent (which is not proof that it was received.)

Isn't there this thing called move that you can do manually?

Even Watts must have figured out that he had to move the message to a sent folder.

Toto · 07-02-2013, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Carr

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

I don't think the email program, whatever it is, would put the message into the sent folder unless it was actually sent (which is not proof that it was received.)

Isn't there this thing called move that you can do manually?

Even Watts must have figured out that he had to move the message to a sent folder.

It takes a devious mind - I tried it in Outlook, and while you can move a message to the sent folder, it won't necessarily look like this. I created a test message, saved a draft, and moved it to sent - but it did not have a date on it.

But that was just a quick trial.

Steven Carr · 07-02-2013, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steven Carr

Quote:

Originally Posted by Toto

I don't think the email program, whatever it is, would put the message into the sent folder unless it was actually sent (which is not proof that it was received.)

Isn't there this thing called move that you can do manually?

Even Watts must have figured out that he had to move the message to a sent folder.

It takes a devious mind - I tried it in Outlook, and while you can move a message to the sent folder, it won't necessarily look like this. I created a test message, saved a draft, and moved it to sent - but it did not have a date on it.

But that was just a quick trial.

Interesting. I wonder what happened.

I still don't see how the system time jumped on his screenshots, and how Watts wrote an email asking Neil to look at Wordpress statements 9 hours before Watts contacted Wordpress.

Toto · 07-02-2013, 01:51 PM

Email Date Spoofer

Quote:

Email Date Spoofer is a tool with a pretty self-explanatory name - it allows you to send emails from any address and with any timestamp. It can be easily handled by users with no experience in this type of apps.

A program like this one can be fun to use when you want to fool your friends. For example, you can send them emails from Santa Claus or from their favorite Hollywood star.

But it's Windows based...

Steven Carr · 07-02-2013, 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stephan huller

I can't believe anyone would manufacture something so easily spotted as an alleged fake like this. There must be another explanation.

I'm sure you are right.

I look forward to Joel Watts putting my suspicions to rest with an explanation. He hasn't given one so far, but I'm sure he will.

After all, all there is at the moment are some suspicious screenshots.

I'm sure there is a simple explanation.

I would be astonished if it really did turn out to be the case that Joel Watts turned off his wifi and then created an image of an email after changing the system date on his machine.

I don't believe that really happened, and look forward to apologising for implying it did, after Joel has explained the full facts to us.

Tenorikuma · 07-02-2013, 06:25 PM

I use a Mac too. It is very strange that the system time says June 26, and he has other emails in the screenshot dated June 27. I can't think of a way that would happen off the top of my head. He must have set his clock back for some reason.

That aside, it is trivial to write an email, save it to your Drafts folder, and then manually move it to your Sent folder so it looks as though it's been sent. I tried it just now to see if it works, and it does. The only problem is that to make the email show an earlier date, you would… you would have to set your system clock back to an earlier date.

I think that's a smoking gun. His screenshot shows that he has set his clock back one or more days (if there is another explanation, I'm all ears), and the only reason I can think of to do that would be to give a fake "sent" email a fake date. Unfortunately for him, he forgot to set the clock back to the correct date before taking his screenshot.

If we had no reason to doubt Watts's honesty, this wouldn't even be a question worth raising. But he feigned ignorance at why Vridar was shut down, and then pretended his site had never had a CC notice up, and then pretended that the timing of the CC message's removal was simply a coincidence.

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07-02-2013, 01:11 PM	#162
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	There's an app that syncs Outlook with Gmail.

07-02-2013, 01:20 PM	#163
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	And you can see that Joel Watts has revealed his email address (which I was asked to removed, and did), which is not a gmail address - at suddenlink.net. But that time clock at the top right hand corner is a puzzlement. And all of the other screen shots do show "connected to gmail."

07-02-2013, 01:21 PM	#164
stephan huller Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: seattle, wa Posts: 9,337	it is a puzzle

07-02-2013, 06:25 PM	#170
Tenorikuma Regular Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Japan Posts: 156	I use a Mac too. It is very strange that the system time says June 26, and he has other emails in the screenshot dated June 27. I can't think of a way that would happen off the top of my head. He must have set his clock back for some reason. That aside, it is trivial to write an email, save it to your Drafts folder, and then manually move it to your Sent folder so it looks as though it's been sent. I tried it just now to see if it works, and it does. The only problem is that to make the email show an earlier date, you would… you would have to set your system clock back to an earlier date. I think that's a smoking gun. His screenshot shows that he has set his clock back one or more days (if there is another explanation, I'm all ears), and the only reason I can think of to do that would be to give a fake "sent" email a fake date. Unfortunately for him, he forgot to set the clock back to the correct date before taking his screenshot. If we had no reason to doubt Watts's honesty, this wouldn't even be a question worth raising. But he feigned ignorance at why Vridar was shut down, and then pretended his site had never had a CC notice up, and then pretended that the timing of the CC message's removal was simply a coincidence.

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