DCHindley

Stephan,

That might work for translation, but I am speaking about just getting a clean Latin text.

I'll provide an example.

From Book V, CAP. XXV, [pg. 390]


1. ET non tantum *autem per ea quae dicta sunt, sed 7et per ea quae erunt sub Antichristo, ostenditur, quoniam exsistens apostate et latro, quasi Deus vult adorari; et cum sit servus, regem se vult praeconari. Ille enim omnem suscipiens diaboli virtutem, veniet non quasi rex justus, nec quasi in subjectione Dei legitimus; eed impius et injustus et sine lege, quasi apostata et iniquus et ...

The actual text is:


1. ET non tantum ⁶autem per ea quae dicta sunt, sed ⁷et per ea quae erunt sub Antichristo, ostenditur, quoniam exsistens apostate et latro, quasi Deus vult adorari; et cum sit servus, regem se vult praeconari. Ille enim omnem suscipiens diaboli virtutem, veniet non quasi rex justus, nec quasi in subjectione Dei legitimus; sed impius et injustus et sine lege, quasi apostata et iniquus et ...

Basically, little misspellings all over the place. The text above has already had most of the ligature problems corrected. In my youth I could scan this with no trouble whatsoever, but in the last few years my eyesight gets ever worse (nearsightedness, trifocal lenses, focus problems and a rather large floater bouncing around in my left eyeball). Imagine tediously going through 400+ Word pages (about 1200 original pages, although I skipped all the critical notes which really cut things down) If I had some bucks, I could buy a bigger monitor, but alas, no bucks ...

DCH

DCHindley

You'd think that a program that can scan and read Latin would be able to handle ligatures. FWIW, it handles "Fi" just fine. I think the problem is that it cannot read one fused ligature and render it in more than one letter. æ or æ = ae, and œ œ = oe. Don't even get me started on Greek diacritics, which ABBYY cannot accurately read for the life of it. I think it is optimized for modern Greek, not ancient Greek.

Like you, I discovered there are no spell checkers available for Latin text. You can, apparently, cobble together a simple one for use in Word but with severe limitations.

Don't have access to it here in rural Ohio.

Yes, I am including them:

CAP.		PAG.
I.	Narratio omnis argumenti discipulorum Valentini	8
II.	Expositio proedicationis veritatis, quam ab Apostolis Ecclesia percipiens custodit	90
III.	Ostensio neque plus, ncque minus de ea quae est fide posse quosdam dicere	92
IV.	Secundum quid fiat putare alios quidem plus, alios vero minus habere agnitionis	94
V.	Quae est Valentini sententia, in quibus discrepant adversus	98
VI.	Quae sunt, in quibus non consonant adversus invicem hi, qui sunt a Valentino omnes. Quae est Colorbaseorum et Marci doctrina	109
VII.	Quae est industria Marci, et qum sunt Quae ab eo. Qualis conversatio ipsorum, et quae est figuratio vitas	114
VIII.	Quemadmodum quidam ex eis per numeros, et per syllabas et per Uteros conantur constituere eam, Quae est secundum eos, argumentationem ......	127
IX.	Quomodo solvunt parabolas . . .	157
X.	Quemadmodum conversationem secundum figuram egus, qui apud eos Pleroma, exponunt factam .	164
XI.	Quemadmodum ea quae sunt in Lege in tuum transferunt figmentum .......	169
ΧII.	Quemadmodum incognitum omnibus inducere conantur Patrem
XIII.	Quibus ex Scripturis testimoniis utuntur	177
XIV.	De redemptione sua quanta dicunt et faciunt: quot modi sunt apud eos redhibitionis: quemadmodum imbuunt eos, qui sibi credunt, et quibus sermonibus utuntur	180

DCH

Cheerful Charlie

Sounds like fun.

One wishes there was a way to set up a master website and get as many members of academia as possible involved. The are some sources, Philip Schlaf's ante and post Nicean series for example, but even there is is hardly complete, much important Augustine works are no there and so on. William of Okhams theological works are almost absent from the net. And more.

Obviously they were impressed by your efforts. So just write what you know about your effrors and that would be good because that is what they obviously want. You can't miss.

Cheerful Charlie

Roger Pearse

Thank you!

DCHindley

Just to provide a sample of what I hope to eventually turn this into follows:

Ante Nicene Fathers, tr. by Alexander Roberts [this translation breaks the text into sections based on Massuet's edition]	Greek fragments (available online, apparently scanned from Harvey's ed but attributed to Migne's PG)	Latin Text in Harvey's edition, (hopefully all errors caught). Numbers in Brackets represent page numbers.
Against Heresies, 1.1	Epiphanius Panarion 31.10.5-10	Eclectic text, Lib. I.i.1
1. They maintain, then, that in the invisible and ineffable heights above there exists a certain perfect, pre-existent AEon,	1.1.1 [5] ΛΕΓΟΥΣΙ γάρ τινα εἶναι ἐν ἀοράτοις καὶ ἀκατονομάστοις ὑψώμασι τέλειον Αἰῶνα προόντα·	[8] 1. DICUNT esse quendam in invisibilibus, et inenarrabilibus alitudinibus perfectum Aeonem, qui ante fuit.
`whom they call Proarche, Propator, and Bythus,	τοῦτον δὲ καὶ προαρχὴν καὶ προπάτορα καὶ Βυθὸν καλοῦσιν.	Hunc autem et Proarchen, et Propatora, et Bython vocant:
and describe as being invisible and incomprehensible.	......	esse autem illum invisibilem, et quem nulla res capere possit.
Eternal and unbegotten, he remained throughout innumerable cycles of ages in profound serenity and quiescence.	ὑπάρχοντα δ' αὐτὸν ἀχώρητον καὶ ἀόρατον, ἀΐδιόν τε καὶ ἀγέννητον, ἐν ἡσυχίᾳ καὶ ἠρεμίᾳ πολλῇ γεγονέναι ἐν ἀπείροις αἰῶσι χρόνων.	Cum autem a nullo caperetur, et esset invisibilis, sempiternus, et ingenitus, in silentio et in quiete multa fuisse, in immensis aeonibus.
There existed along with him Ennoea, whom they also call Charis and Sige.	συνυπάρχειν δ' αὐτῷ καὶ Ἔννοιαν, ἣν δὴ καὶ Χάριν, καὶ Σιγὴν ὀνομάζουσι	Cum [9] ipso autem fuisse et Ennoean, quam etiam Charin, et Sigen vocant:
At last this Bythus determined to send forth from himself the beginning of all things, and deposited this production (which he had resolved to bring forth) in his contemporary Sige, even as seed is deposited in the womb.	[6] καὶ ἐννοηθῆναί ποτε ἀφ' ἑαυτοῦ προβαλέσθαι τὸν Βυθὸν τοῦτον, ἀρχὴν τῶν πάντων καὶ καθάπερ σπέρμα, τὴν προβολὴν ταύτην, ἣν προβαλέσθαι ἐνενοήθη, καὶ καθέσθαι ὡς ἐν μήτρᾳ τῇ συνυπαρχούσῃ ἑαυτῷ Σιγῇ·	et aliquando voluisse a semetipso emittere hunc Bythum initium omnium, et velut semen prolationem hanc praemitti voluit, et eam deposuisse quasi in vulva ejus, quae cum eo erat, Sige.
She then, having received this seed, and becoming pregnant, gave birth to Nous, who was both similar and equal to him who had produced him, and was alone capable of comprehending his father's greatness.	[7] ταύτην δὲ ὑποδεξαμένην τὸ σπέρμα τοῦτο καὶ ἐγκύμονα γενομένην, ἀποκυῆσαι Νοῦν, ὅμοιόν τε καὶ ἶσον τῷ προβαλόντι, καὶ μόνον χωροῦντα τὸ μέγεθος τοῦ Πατρός·	Hanc autem suscepisse semen hoc, et praegnantem factam generasse Nun, similem et aequalem ei, qui emiserat, et solum capientem magnitudinem Patris.
This Nous they call also Monogenes, and Father, and the Beginning of all Things.	τὸν δὲ Νοῦν τοῦτον καὶ Μονογενῆ καλοῦσι, καὶ Πατέρα, καὶ Ἀρχὴν τῶν πάντων·	Nun autem hunc, et Unigenitum vocant, et Patrem, et Initium omnium.
Along with him was also produced Aletheia;	συμπροβεβλῆσθαι δὲ αὐτῷ Ἀλήθειαν·	Una autem cum eo emissam Veritatem,
and these four constituted the first and first-begotten Pythagorean Tetrad, which they also denominate the root of all things.	καὶ εἶναι ταύτην πρῶτον καὶ ἀρχέγονον Πυθαγορικὴν τετρακτὺν, ἣν καὶ ῥίζαν τῶν πάντων καλοῦσιν·	et hanc esse primam et primogenitam Pythagoricam quaternationem, quam et radicem omnium dicunt.
For there are first Bythus and Sige, and then Nous and Aletheia.	[8] ἔστι γὰρ Βυθὸς καὶ Σιγὴ, ἔπειτα Νοῦς καὶ Ἀλήθεια.	Est enim Bythus et Sige, deinde Nus et [10] Alethia.
And Monogenes, perceiving for what purpose he had been produced, also himself sent forth Logos and Zoe, being the father of all those who were to come after him, and the beginning and fashioning of the entire Pleroma.	[9] Αἰσθόμενόν τε τὸν Μονογενῆ τοῦτον ἐφ' οἷς προεβλήθη, προβαλεῖν καὶ αὐτὸν Λόγον καὶ Ζωὴν, πατέρα πάντων τῶν μετ' αὐτὸν ἐσομένων, καὶ ἀρχὴν καὶ μόρφωσιν παντὸς τοῦ πληρώματος.	Sentientem autem Unigenitum hunc in quae prolatus est, emisisse et ipsum Logon et Zoen, patrem omnium eorum, qui post se futuri essent, et initium et formationem universi Pleromatis.
By the conjunction of Logos and Zoe were brought forth Anthropos and Ecclesia;	Ἐκ δὴ τοῦ Λόγου καὶ τῆς Ζωῆς προβεβλῆσθαι κατὰ συζυγίαν Ἄνθρωπον καὶ Ἐκκλησίαν·	De Logo autem et Zoe emissum secundum conjugationem, Hominem et Ecclesiam,
and thus was formed the first-begotten Ogdoad, the root and substance of all things, called among them by four names,	[10] καὶ εἶναι ταύτην ἀρχέγονον Ὀγδοάδα, ῥίζαν καὶ ὑπόστασιν τῶν πάντων, τέτρασιν ὀνόμασι παρ' αὐτοῖς καλουμένων, [l. καλουμένην]	et esse hanc primogenitam Octonationem, radicem et substantiam omnium, quatuor nominibus apud eos nuncupatam,
viz., Bythus, and Nous, and Logos, and Anthropos.	Βυθῷ, καὶ Νῷ, καὶ Λόγῳ, καὶ Ἀνθρώπῳ	Bython, et Nun, et Logon, et Anthropon.
For each of these is masculo-feminine, as follows:	εἶναι γὰρ αὐτῶν ἕκαστον ἀῤῥενόθηλυν·	Esse enim illorum unumquemque masculo-foeminam, sic,
Propator was united by a conjunction with his Ennoea;	οὕτως πρῶτον τὸν Προπάτορα ἡνῶσθαι κατὰ συζυγίαν τῇ ἑαυτοῦ Ἐννοίᾳ·	initio Propatorem illum coisse secundum conjugationem suas Ennoeae,
[that is, to thought, which they call Grace and Silence] Omitted from ANF translation. Scribal gloss?		id est, cogitationi, quam Gratiam et Silentium vocant:
then Monogenes, that is Nous, with Aletheia;	τὸν δὲ Μονογενῆ, τουτέστι τὸν Νοῦν, τῇ Ἀληθείᾳ·	Unigenitum autem, hoc est, Nun Alethiae, id est, Veritati:
Logos with Zoe, and Anthropos with Ecclesia.	τὸν δὲ Λόγον τῇ Ζωῇ, καὶ τὸν Ἄνθρωπον τῇ Ἐκκλησίᾳ.	Logon autem Zoae, id est, Vitae: et Anthropon cum Ecclesia.

In time I hope to do this kind of thing to major works of all ante-Nicene fathers. Bwooo-haaa-haaa-haaa! :devil2:

DCH

stephan huller

Don't forget to add the Philosophumena book 6 at starting at chapter 13 in Irenaeus book 1 until chapter 21. also eusebius quotes chapter 21 or a part of it in Church History. Epiphanius attributes part of chapter 21 to the Heracleonites

DCHindley

Haven't forgot (it's right there in Harvey's edition, and I was only citing the 1st third of chapter 1 of Donaldson's translation, so relax ...).

If I do this I would have a separate column for each Greek source.

DCH