Opera Nut

Soul Invictus, you are right. There are black African Jews, Oriental Jews, Eastern European Jews, Western European Jews, South American Jews, Hispanic Jews, etc. Judaism is a culture and is not a race. I think the Xtians hate them because of their emphasis on education and accomplishment, and their sophisticated thinking, by modern standards. It's ok to question god, even to yell at him and scream, which is not allowed in the Xtian church. The only answer you get is "It's God's will" which is a total copout. The number of outstanding Jews in all fields of endeavor is amazing, and it's not that they are actually smarter, it's just that they grow up in a culture of excellence.

Also, the conservative Xtians are not in favor of real liberal arts education and are afraid of their students being exposed to other cultures and values. This is why a conservative Xtian college is at odds with the goals of a secular or liberal university -- to broaden the student's horizons and teach them the history of Western thought, literature, science, arts and literature.

As I have stated several times before,I went to a very well known Presbyterian school where I took some very difficult and interesting religion courses. They were history and philosophy courses. The school I went to is rated as the best liberal arts college west of the Mississippi, according to the US News and World Report College rankings. My parents were smart enough to not send me to someplace like Baylor which is in Waco, the Vatican City of the Baptists.

And Yiddish is merely medieval German, which is why it sounds German. But I don't think I could make it without some of the wonderful Yiddish words in the American vocabulary -- like kitsch, dreck, tchotchkes, nosh, schlep.

Magus55

Judaism is a culture and a religion. Jewish, is a race or ethnic group, but i'm not referring to race as skin color ( although, there are no african american Jews that are related to Abraham afaik. Have yet to see an authentic African American Jew, not just a convert). By Jewish law, anyone can become a Jewish convert ( that is, to the Jewish culture and religion), however - you can never become a blood decendant of Abraham ( Jewish ethnicity). Thats like saying a Caucasian can become African American. If you aren't born of that blood line, you can't be that group.

If you convert to Judaism, and become a Jew under Jewish law, are you now a direct blood relative of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob? Nope. Why do you think in the Bible they make distinct references between Jews under Christ, and Gentiles?

Starboy

IIRC, there is a tribe of Africans in central to southern west Africa that claim to be Jews and have been tested genetically and found to have the "Cohen" mitochondria genes. For god’s favorite people they have been forced to spread across the globe in a long series of Diasporas. So it is certainly possible if not likely that some of these made it here and are present in the population.

Starboy

Starboy

Kevin, if there is a god and it wants me to be like Jesus then it doesn't need your help. God can turn me into Jesus anytime it wants. The fact that it hasn't done so indicates that it thinks one Jesus was enough or it could mean that god is irrelevant or possibly even non-existent. Insisting on changing people to be as you think they should be when they have no interest in doing so is intolerant.

You can believe in your uberdaddy as I choose not to. If we both respected each others choice then that would be tolerance. That is the point of freedom of religion and separation of church and state. Many of the Christians in this country don't get it and I fear you are one of them. This intolerant attitude of Christians is how Christianity becomes death, destruction and hatred. Tolerance is how you learn to live with different neighbors in peace if not harmony. If love and peace where more than just words used in the Christian propaganda you thoughtlessly spew you would understand this. Proselytizing your neighbors is not how to show tolerance towards them.

Starboy

Paperstreet

The "Jews for Jesus" people are despised by the Jews. Trust me, I know. I used to attend Jewish Sunday school, from age 5, to age 13 (when I was Bar Mitzvahed and did not have to attend anymore) and the teachers always made fun of the Jews for Jesus sect.

Do Messanic Jews have bar/bat mitzvahs? What books of the New Testament do they accept? Being Jewish means you are Jewish... you go to synagogue not church... you DO NOT accept Jesus as the savior. Judaism is a religion. Jewish is what you would call a person who follows Judaism. Let me put it in analogy form:

Judiasm:Jewish as
Islam:Mulsim

Yeah, Judaism is a culture... but I guarentee you worshipping Jesus is not included in that culture.

Being Jewish means you do not accept Jesus as your savior. Being Christian means you accept Jesus as your savior. A Jew can not accept Jesus as their savior.

There are exceptions, like if you lived in the ancient kingdom of Judah. (which I guarentee you don't) Then you could make the claim "I am Jewish!"

I really don't understand Messanic Jews, so if I said incorrect things, sorry, but there is one fact that is right: They ain't popular!

Magus55

You are quite right in that you don't understand Messianic Jews.

Yes Messianic Jews get bar mitzvahs. As far as I know, they follow the whole NT. And they don't go to church, they go to a Messianic synagogue. Being Jewish, does not mean you don't accept Jesus. That is the biggest cliche in the entire Jewish world. The apostles were Jewish, and remained Jewish, yet they believed in Jesus as the Messiah.

Messianic Judaism isn't unpopular, in fact more and more Jews are becoming Messianic. Why do you think its now recognized in Israel?

Sabine Grant

I hold great respect for Messianic Jews as they project the genealogy and jewish heritage of Christ Himself. And I am a christian. I do not see how being a Jew and accepting Christ as the Messiah is a contradiction. Jesus was a jew and celebrated judaic holidays. The first act of communion was dispensed during a Passover meal.
I also support the statement that jew is a defined race ( hebrew) and judaism is a religion. We have many jews in France who do not practice judaism yet they do identify themselves as jewish. My ancestors were such from Germany. My father's last name ( Schwartz) is considered in France as a jewish name. So are names such as Drey, Levy, Cohen etc...
There is presently a renewal of " jewishness" in some christian denominations where jewish traditions and the hebrew language are restored. A little church I attended for a while in Naples, Italy, displayed the Star of David and we often sang choruses in hebrew.
I think the notion of a jewish race is more accepted in Europe than it is in the US.

Sabine Grant

Hello Opera Nut or should I say shalom? I am quite concerned as to your generalization that " the Xtians hate them". It basicaly implies that as a christian myself I hate a particular group of people. You may want to moderate your statements to " some christians". Imagine if I stated " atheists hate christians".

Yiddish is a defined dialect which originated among the jewish population of Germany. However, Yiddish is not spoken among all jewish communities in Europe. French jews speak French and their religious instruction ( if they are practicing judaics) is in hebrew not in Yiddish.

Starboy

Sabine, you miss the point entirely. How can you claim you like a group of people when your stated goal is to turn them into people like yourself?

Starboy

Sabine Grant

I made no claim. I had to refute the claim of Opera Nut that as part of the "Xstians"" who hate jews" I then hate jews.
Moderation in some statements is wise. Such generalizations are immature and irrational. I expect more from any humanist.
Now Starboy if you wish to twist semantics and define any christian as a jew hater, you may fall under the fire of being accused yourself to be an individual who hates christians so much for you wish for them to abandon their faith to join your humanism....
There is no support to anyone making blunt generalizations. And again, show me your humanism Starboy....