Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Thor Q. Mada · 12-23-2002, 04:28 PM

The title of this tread is wrong. The pope didn't "accept" the miracle.
He instigated it. The second miracle will now come pretty soon. I don't understand how I can write this without throwing-up all over my keyboard.
The old man is a monster and a criminal all right. I just don't know if he is still alive or whether it is just is the roman gang that has put a broomstick in his ass and wheels him around. What a pathetic display. How come the world doesn't scream foul when they see such a travesty I don't know.
Of-course the church is in need of a bit of "beefing" up lately but faked miracles is not going to be of great help.
And for my friend Gemma, that people believe in miracles and saints is indeed a miracle. But then again, they believe in astrology, soothsayers, alien abductions etc.
All the same sad stuff of people in dire need of psychological support. Don't they know there are doctors??

Thor Q. Mada · 12-23-2002, 05:10 PM

thebeave,

Don't you know that the saying "to achieve a target, all means are acceptable" is contributed rightly or wrongly to the Jezuits??

12-23-2002, 05:30 PM

I am still trying to find resources that give specific information about the methodology employed to determine the veracity of the miracle.

I would be absolutely delighted to see the sort of mistakes are made in various cases.

Blood liquifying every year *lol*.

thebeave · 12-23-2002, 06:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Thor Q. Mada:
<strong>thebeave,

Don't you know that the saying "to achieve a target, all means are acceptable" is contributed rightly or wrongly to the Jezuits??</strong>

As Johnny Carson would say, "I did not know that!"

Thor Q. Mada · 12-23-2002, 06:08 PM

Hey guys, have a good year-end, a good 2003 and don't drink too much.

lpetrich · 12-24-2002, 10:11 AM

The "Society of Jesus", the Jesuit order, had indeed had a reputation of making a principle out of "the end justifies the means".

The Jesuits had also had a reputation for conniving and political intrigue in centuries past; does anyone know any details?

In fairness, they have often been good at education and science, at least in areas that the Church did not object to.

And in the 17th cy., if one is to believe Pascal, the Jesuits were very popular as confessors, because they were relatively lenient on sins other than heresy. However, Pascal had been a Jansenist, a follower of a sect that was rather fervently anti-Jesuit.

hinduwoman · 12-25-2002, 04:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sullster:
<strong>

Hinduwoman,
You are Indian and must feel a type of cultural violation when the dominant religious sect of Western Europe is busy concocting miracles in order to make a saint of someone who clearly wanted to convert Indians to catholicism.

As for your idea of diversion of attention from the molestation scandals as a motivation for this medievalism, I say that is probably a part of the explanation. The other part is the clear attempt to spread catholicism in India. Just you wait, your Hindu dieties will soon have halos and be declared saints. Watch out, they are good at cultural conquest.</strong>

The Hindu organizations here are fighting back ever since Pope said that the third millenium would see a rich harvest in the Third World.
I expect to see more quarrels, propaganda and even outright fights between the two groups.
And oh yeah, there is a group that wants to be the Indian national church --- they have been excommunicated by the Pope.
And of course there are the numerous Protestant denominations all vying for converts.
(sigh!)

Thor Q. Mada · 12-25-2002, 05:40 PM

I have been twelve years in a Jezuit college. This explains at least 80% of my loathing for the hypocrisy and the lies of the church. Unlike the common parish priest, these guys were smart,and scheming indeed. I hate them because they knowingly and cunningly mislead people.

Amie · 12-27-2002, 02:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Thor Q. Mada
Unlike the common parish priest, these guys were smart,and scheming indeed. I hate them because they knowingly and cunningly mislead people.

in regards to your experience at the college what makes you feel that they were intentionally trying to deceive people?

Gemma Therese · 12-27-2002, 08:00 PM

And atheists care about who is canonized in the Catholic Church ... why?

Gemma Therese

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12-23-2002, 04:28 PM	#41
Thor Q. Mada Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Asia Posts: 3,558	The title of this tread is wrong. The pope didn't "accept" the miracle. He instigated it. The second miracle will now come pretty soon. I don't understand how I can write this without throwing-up all over my keyboard. The old man is a monster and a criminal all right. I just don't know if he is still alive or whether it is just is the roman gang that has put a broomstick in his ass and wheels him around. What a pathetic display. How come the world doesn't scream foul when they see such a travesty I don't know. Of-course the church is in need of a bit of "beefing" up lately but faked miracles is not going to be of great help. And for my friend Gemma, that people believe in miracles and saints is indeed a miracle. But then again, they believe in astrology, soothsayers, alien abductions etc. All the same sad stuff of people in dire need of psychological support. Don't they know there are doctors??

12-23-2002, 05:10 PM	#42
Thor Q. Mada Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Asia Posts: 3,558	thebeave, Don't you know that the saying "to achieve a target, all means are acceptable" is contributed rightly or wrongly to the Jezuits??

12-23-2002, 05:30 PM	#43
Synaesthesia Guest Posts: n/a	I am still trying to find resources that give specific information about the methodology employed to determine the veracity of the miracle. I would be absolutely delighted to see the sort of mistakes are made in various cases. Blood liquifying every year lol.

12-23-2002, 06:08 PM	#45
Thor Q. Mada Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Asia Posts: 3,558	Hey guys, have a good year-end, a good 2003 and don't drink too much.

12-24-2002, 10:11 AM	#46
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	The "Society of Jesus", the Jesuit order, had indeed had a reputation of making a principle out of "the end justifies the means". The Jesuits had also had a reputation for conniving and political intrigue in centuries past; does anyone know any details? In fairness, they have often been good at education and science, at least in areas that the Church did not object to. And in the 17th cy., if one is to believe Pascal, the Jesuits were very popular as confessors, because they were relatively lenient on sins other than heresy. However, Pascal had been a Jansenist, a follower of a sect that was rather fervently anti-Jesuit.

12-25-2002, 05:40 PM	#48
Thor Q. Mada Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Asia Posts: 3,558	I have been twelve years in a Jezuit college. This explains at least 80% of my loathing for the hypocrisy and the lies of the church. Unlike the common parish priest, these guys were smart,and scheming indeed. I hate them because they knowingly and cunningly mislead people.

12-27-2002, 08:00 PM	#50
Gemma Therese Senior Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: new york Posts: 608	And atheists care about who is canonized in the Catholic Church ... why? Gemma Therese

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