FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > IIDB ARCHIVE: 200X-2003, PD 2007 > IIDB Philosophical Forums (PRIOR TO JUN-2003)
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Yesterday at 05:55 AM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 07-22-2003, 05:45 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: umop apisbn
Posts: 568
Default Jehova's Witnesses are a strange lot

Had a couple of this lot turn up on my doorstep the other day. Ended up having an interesting little discussion.

What intrigues me about them is that they manage to combine extreme pessimism ("Things are getting worse every day, and all human civilisation is doomed to fail") with extreme optimism ("But there will come a day when we will all live in an eternal utopia")

I know this isn't a unique idea within Christianity, but they certainly seem much more zeroed in on the issue than other Christian sects.

Perhaps they're just trying to cover all their bases and appeal to the cynics and the dreamers?
andy_d is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 05:54 AM   #2
Contributor
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: With 10,000 lakes who needs a coast?
Posts: 10,762
Default

Nope, it's a two-prong con. First, convince you (falsely) that the world is a horrible place and getting worse. When that gets you really depressed, they offer the glorious happy afterlife (also false).

They give you the poison, then sell you the antidote. A classic scam.
Godless Dave is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 06:27 AM   #3
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Ithaca, NY
Posts: 471
Default

The Twelve Tribes, the group I've been researching, do that too. They find people who already seem alienated, convince them that the whole world is corrupt and fake and shallow, and then offer them a "genuine" community of godliness - that just happens to involve turning over all their assets to the cult and working as a slave laborer in a cult-run business.

When you think about it, it makes perfect sense. In a society as God-soaked as ours, you have to be pretty negative towards any involvement with the real world if you hope to get the lost souls into your little cult, instead of say the fundie arm of the Baptists, where they could be equally crazy and judgemental but with more creature comforts.

the.villainess
villainess is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 06:38 AM   #4
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Tampa Bay area
Posts: 3,471
Default

The one thing that really bothers me about the JW, besides all those insipidly happy smiley faces on the cover of their magazines, is their idea that all humanity will end up being ruled by a theocracy--of course supposedly taking their orders from JC--(or maybe from God himself-------I forget right now whether they believe Jesus was anything more than a prophet.--I know they do not believe in a Trinity)

Knowing human nature and how it can pervert and corrupt the best intentions, the idea of a human theocracy ruling the world scares the hell out of me.

I always say "thank you very much, but I am an Episcopalian and have no plans to convert, but will read your magazines when I get aroung 'toit." And close the door.
Rational BAC is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 07:53 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: umop apisbn
Posts: 568
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by Godless Dave
First, convince you (falsely) that the world is a horrible place and getting worse.
They seemed a little dissapointed by some of my opinions. The start of our conversation went something like:

JWs: "Don't you agree that things are getting worse every year?"

Me: "Nope, we've never had it so good. Life used to be short and hard."

JWs: "Er...."

I'm still a little confused by a group who supposedly follow the teachings of Jesus, yet think that there's ultimately not much point in trying to make the world a better place. Still, nice people
andy_d is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 09:07 AM   #6
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Atlanta,GA,USA
Posts: 172
Default

Quote:
Originally posted by andy_d
They seemed a little dissapointed by some of my opinions. The start of our conversation went something like:

JWs: "Don't you agree that things are getting worse every year?"

Me: "Nope, we've never had it so good. Life used to be short and hard."

JWs: "Er...."

I'm still a little confused by a group who supposedly follow the teachings of Jesus, yet think that there's ultimately not much point in trying to make the world a better place. Still, nice people
Yes, they are a nice bunch. I like them, especially because of their dedication. Eventhough I don't believe like them, and think that there are areas in which they are completely wrong...not much difference from the mainstreamers, I would say.

You say that it you are confused by their pessimistic view of the world? I think you did not understand them. They do a lot of work for the needy. Their point is that, instead of putting so much effort in compromises, trying to force them by military power, and other futile tactics, that we should spend more time trying to change from within.

After all, that is where it all begins--within one's own self. If you are rotten inside, you will find any excuse to do wrong.
Milton is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 09:17 AM   #7
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Middlesbrough, England
Posts: 3,909
Default Re: Jehova's Witnesses are a strange lot

Quote:
Originally posted by andy_d
Jehova's Witnesses are a strange lot
Very true. Apparently they're not allowed to give each other blood transfusions for Christmas. I used to love that.

Boro Nut
Boro Nut is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 01:48 PM   #8
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: London, England
Posts: 2,125
Default

They're whacko. I have the misfortune to share office space with one of those fruitcakes - and we work for an organisation whose raison d'etre is to promote secular humanism. How strange is that?

I have to keep a straight face watching her say her prayers before eating her packed lunch, then telling callers: "We are a non-religious organisation that provides help and support for non-religious people etc etc" then phoning her brethren to arrange where they're going out witnessing after work!

She also has to get permission from her leaders before coming to any social events with the rest of us...:banghead:
MollyMac is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 02:36 PM   #9
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Canada
Posts: 149
Default

There are a number of them in our community and they aren't as active here as they used to be. I live in a small town and I remember some of my school chums being dragged by their parents door to door and embarrasing the crap out of them. I think if they still do the door to door thing they must go away from where they live and let others come here. They keep to their own in social situations too, quite antisocial, must be a requirement.
my dog earl is offline  
Old 07-22-2003, 05:05 PM   #10
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Outer Mongolia
Posts: 4,091
Cool

Well, sure, the JWs are fruitcakes with a lot of wacko ideas. But you know what - I put them a rung or two above southern baptists on the sane/insane scale. At least JWs don't believed in the concept of eternal torture for the vast majority who are "non-believers". That shit is totally wack, yet it is one of the big things with the SBs.
JGL53 is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:21 AM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.