Freethought & Rationalism Archive

winstonjen · 01-04-2003, 04:00 PM

I think this poll would be more appropriate that a simple yes/no poll.

Philosoft · 01-04-2003, 04:31 PM

What does it mean to say "other people should have a say in the decision"? Is there a possible scenario wherein another person's or group's opinion should override the woman's?

winstonjen · 01-04-2003, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Philosoft
What does it mean to say "other people should have a say in the decision"? Is there a possible scenario wherein another person's or group's opinion should override the woman's?

No, I don't mean that - I mean that some people should be allowed to try to convince the woman, but it would still be the woman's decision in the end.

Philosoft · 01-04-2003, 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by winstonjen
No, I don't mean that - I mean that some people should be allowed to try to convince the woman, but it would still be the woman's decision in the end.

So that means the bottom-most choice implies people should be prevented from trying to convince the woman?

Amie · 01-04-2003, 05:45 PM

I personally am against abortion however I chose the second option instead of the first. Its just my point of view though...

Winstonjen I get the feeling you think all pro-lifers are a bunch of fanatics. Am I wrong?

winstonjen · 01-04-2003, 08:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Amie
I personally am against abortion however I chose the second option instead of the first. Its just my point of view though...

Winstonjen I get the feeling you think all pro-lifers are a bunch of fanatics. Am I wrong?

No, I don't think they're fanatics. I agree with them in this case more than others. I myself thought that women should be able to do it, but only in the most extreme cases - after all, if the woman doesn't abort, a new child will be born.

Quote:

So that means the bottom-most choice implies people should be prevented from trying to convince the woman?

No, I don't think so, in all cases where I choice is involved, I believe that no one should coerce the woman one way or the other.

Amie · 01-04-2003, 09:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by winstonjen
I myself thought that women should be able to do it, but only in the most extreme cases - after all, if the woman doesn't abort, a new child will be born.

Hi winstonjen
just out of curiosity what would you consider the most extreme cases to be?

L. Noctivagans · 01-04-2003, 11:54 PM

Quote:

I myself thought that women should be able to do it, but only in the most extreme cases - after all, if the woman doesn't abort, a new child will be born.

100% agree.

Most extreme cases: Mother's life is at risk, mother's long-term health is at risk, or mother's future fertility is at risk. All of the above would be justification for using lethal force in self-defense.

The grey areas are rape and incest. I simply don't know enough about those issues to form a firm opinion yet. Forcing the woman to have the child in those cases is DEFINITELY punishing the woman for an event beyond her control. However abortion is always definitely punishing the future child for an event beyond its control. Like I said, I don't have a firm enough grasp of this set of facts to form a defendable position.

Celsus · 01-05-2003, 12:17 AM

I voted option (2), "Abortion should be done only in the most extreme cases - not as a method of birth control". However, that does not mean that it is mutually exclusive with (5) and (6). In fact, I think (5) and (6) are two sides of the same coin, and while my personal opinion is (2), the matter and decision rests entirely with the woman, and her body in question. One cannot stress enough that people must learn to take responsibility for their decisions, but they shouldn't be penalised for life because of a mistake.

Joel

Edit: rape is an extreme case to me.

sullster · 01-05-2003, 12:06 PM

Abortion has been going on for centuries and always will. It can be analyzed forever without getting anywhere.
The big thing is that we can finally have abortions with the woman not dying. That is the breakthrough.
There are more young women walking around than there used to be and safe abortion is the reason.

Isn't the preservation of womens' lives a moral ideal?

View Poll Results: When can Abortion be Justified?
Never! It is murder no matter what the circumstances are!!!	0	0%
Abortion should be done only in the most extreme cases - not as a method of birth control	8	10.67%
If the parents cannot afford to keep the baby	0	0%
If adoption is not possible or if it will kill the mother, the baby, or both.	5	6.67%
The woman has the choice, but other people should also have a say in the decision.	11	14.67%
It's the woman's choice - under any circumstances she can abort	51	68.00%
Voters: 75. You may not vote on this poll

01-04-2003, 04:00 PM	#1
winstonjen Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Brisbane, Australia Posts: 3,425	When is Abortion Moral/Justifed? I think this poll would be more appropriate that a simple yes/no poll.

01-04-2003, 04:31 PM	#2
Philosoft Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast of disorder Posts: 6,829	question What does it mean to say "other people should have a say in the decision"? Is there a possible scenario wherein another person's or group's opinion should override the woman's?

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01-04-2003, 05:45 PM	#5
Amie Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: New York Posts: 1,626	I personally am against abortion however I chose the second option instead of the first. Its just my point of view though... Winstonjen I get the feeling you think all pro-lifers are a bunch of fanatics. Am I wrong?

01-05-2003, 12:17 AM	#9
Celsus Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Singapore Posts: 2,875	I voted option (2), "Abortion should be done only in the most extreme cases - not as a method of birth control". However, that does not mean that it is mutually exclusive with (5) and (6). In fact, I think (5) and (6) are two sides of the same coin, and while my personal opinion is (2), the matter and decision rests entirely with the woman, and her body in question. One cannot stress enough that people must learn to take responsibility for their decisions, but they shouldn't be penalised for life because of a mistake. Joel Edit: rape is an extreme case to me.

01-05-2003, 12:06 PM	#10
sullster Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: North of Boston Posts: 1,392	Abortion has been going on for centuries and always will. It can be analyzed forever without getting anywhere. The big thing is that we can finally have abortions with the woman not dying. That is the breakthrough. There are more young women walking around than there used to be and safe abortion is the reason. Isn't the preservation of womens' lives a moral ideal?

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