Megusic

Something that's been on my mind lately, and I noticed some comments on it from the single mother thread.


I think the ability to create new life is an amazing and beatiful thing, and I can definately understand the need people feel to have their own children, spread their genes. But for myself personally, I just can't see bringing another life into this world when there are so many existing lives in need of help.

However, a while ago I had a dream in which I was pregnant (John Leguizamo was the father, haha). It was a really crazy dream, because it FELT SO REAL. I woke up grabbing my stomach wondering what happened. There is zero chance I could have been pregnant, and have never been pregnant before, which is why this dream completely blew my mind. It really felt cool to feel like a person was living inside of me (now don't start thinking I'm crazy, but I'm telling you, it was very realistic feeling!). Since then, a part of me feels like maybe I do want to have a child of my own some day. I know this is a totally natural feeling, but it also feels very selfish to me. I'm so confused on what to do and what's the 'right' thing for me...

What are your thoughts?

(note: i am not planning on having any children in my life for a looooooooong time, it's not like i have to make up my mind tomorrow....)

Seraphim

Children ... hmmm ... of my own ... can't imagine one though ...

I'm not married and not sure whether I going to get married any time soon. Always had been too anti-social to get anyone pregnant ... unless someone gets me really, REALLY drunk.

But someone told me that You will change totally when you have your own children. That you will have sense of purpose and responsibility and that you will live life not for yourself anymore but for sake of someone else as well.

Not sure why ... maybe it is like the sense of that you are some what ... immortal now that you had passed your genes to another organism. Maybe ...

Maybe having children is humanity way of defeating death. Not believing in God that beats Death but bring in another life ...

Alonzo Fyfe

You may have some sort of preference for devoting your time and energy to raising other peoples' children, but unless you are going to universalize this principle (and, thus, condemn everybody who has a child of their own) it would be difficult to claim that this is some sort of MORAL imperative.

Like all personal preferences, you are free to change your mind as you see fit, based on whatever new information you may discover, such as a sensation from a dream.

However, I would like to point out that, unless you have been pregnant, how do you know that the feelings from the dream were 'realistic'? It is possible that what you experienced were not 'realistic' sensations but 'idealistic' sensations constructed in your own mind.

Seraphim

... Since then, a part of me feels like maybe I do want to have a child of my own some day. I know this is a totally natural feeling, but it also feels very selfish to me. I'm so confused on what to do and what's the 'right' thing for me...

Forgive my earlier post which was somewhat talking out my mind ...

Why don't you have one (you give birth yourself) and another you adopt?

It doesn't matter whether a baby is yours or not, you are a mother either way ...

Daleth

I don't think there's any really good answer, Megusic. It's so deeply personal. Many women want to experience pregnancy first hand. Many want to know that first moment a child opens their eyes. Many people just want to raise someone and watch them grow. Many more people would adopt if it wouldn't mean a second mortgage. You can, as mentioned, do both. It's not unreasonable to think about it. You said you've got lots of time, so take it. You may decide and redecide 20 times between now and then.

Dal

Pyrrho

I think that caring for children who already exist is generally more altruistic than having children of one's own. There are children who need good homes, and it is good if someone provides a good home for one or more of them. Plus, if there is one thing the world does not need any more of, it is people. Having so many people degrades the quality of life for everyone (if you disagree, consider, the next time you are in rush hour traffic, what it would be like with more people in traffic). People who have children are not doing the world any favors.

Many people want a little copy of themselves, so they can be like a god. They want to live on, but, of course, they die like everyone else anyway, so they are only fooling themselves. And, interestingly enough, the women who have children in fact risk cutting their lives short (not to mention all of the health problems that are possible), as women do die from pregnancy and childbirth from time to time.

But, of course, from a legal perspective, one can choose to give birth if one wishes, and many do. However, I expect that most are due to either failed birth control (or none available, as in certain parts of the world), or people choosing to have children because they think it is what everyone is "supposed" to do. People are like sheep, and go along with the herd.

If you do decide to adopt instead of having children the old-fashioned way, you can always reflect on the fact that you do not run the risk of tearing during the birth process (or avoid it by being cut), nor will you run the risks of other health problems associated with having children. Anyone contemplating having children should watch a few documentaries on the subject, and speak with some nurses who work in maternity wards in hospitals. Many women who have children don't know what is in store for them beforehand, and I think that is one of the reasons they are willing to have children. After the first one, some of the damage is already done, and they may feel like they have less to lose at that point, so the second one may be less unappealing.

Daleth

That's a really grim view, Pyrrho. Ouch!

Many people have children because they actually really want children. I think you're going way too far in dismissing it as herd mentality. Many people want children and pursue having them when most of the world thinks they should not (gays, lesbians, single people).

I'll grant you that a lot of folks do not give it enough thought beforehand, but although I've asked many, I've found few parents who will say if they had the choice to make again, they'd have no kids. At any rate, Megusic pretty clearly can't be accused of lack of forethought in the matter. Same can be said for a lot of us.

That said, it's not that easy to adopt. A lot of people can't spend $10,000 to get a child and then still afford to raise and educate it. the requirements can be very rough. They can be very picky about age and home-ownership and religious background and lots of things.

And I think most of us know exactly what we're getting into with pregnancy and labor. Women just love to tell their horror stories, you know. It's hard for a girl to avoid.

Dal

ETA: In case this came out all wrong, in no way did I mean to advocate parenthood for all, parenthood the most nobel of acts, or any such nonsense.

Pyrrho

I never denied that, nor did I mean to deny it. But I don't think that that is the whole story, nor do I think it is the actual reason in most cases. (By "most", of course, I mean more than half.)



And what else can they say afterwards? Do you think people like saying that they have made a terrible mistake, particularly when parenthood is glorified? Many members of society will judge them to be bad if they say that. Besides, no decent parent would publicly say that they wish they did not have children, because their own children may hear about it, and this would not be good for them. (It is generally regarded as psychological abuse for a parent to tell a child, "I wish you had never been born.")



True.


I disagree. See what "openeyes" stated in:

http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...0&pagenumber=1

I think most women don't know about all of the potential problems, or even the most common ones. Now, if anyone knows of any tests that have been given to women before they ever got pregnant, in which their knowledge of the potential problems was actually tested rather than speculated about, that might be helpful at this point. But in the absence of that, can you honestly say that you know even one woman who has said that there were absolutely no surprises in giving birth for the first time, that she was fully aware of everything that might happen before it happened?

Pyrrho

The truth about most things is pretty grim. That is why people tend to believe in fairy tales, instead of facing the world honestly.

Daleth

Pyrrho,

The truth about most things is not pretty, but that's a stretch to grim.

I can not honestly say I have met a woman who was not surprised by something in childbirth, but in my experience what most women are surprised by is their own reaction. No amount of education can tell you how you'll react. Personally, yes, I was as fully aware of all the possibilities as I think I could be short of a medical degree. I'm glad I've forgotten a lot of what I learned. I obsessed.

Well, yes, if what they are doing is trying to talk you out of having a child, which has been the reason I've put the question to them. I have known people to say they wish they'd stopped at one child and people who say they wish they had waited longer. I know my sister will willingly admit she should never have been a mother. These aren't public conversations. These are very private, and anybody who knows me well enough to discuss something so personal also knows I'm not going to repeat it to their kids. I know a lot of bright people. I don't think they are blinded by what society glorifies.

But of course I also know people who fit the description you're giving. It read to me as rather too broad. It read to me like a mild attack on people who want to have children, overall.

Dal

(Just cause I'm new here, I'll tack on my perspective. I'm 31. I've gone through labor and delivery twice to stillborns. I very much want to have one child, not to repopulate the earth or to immortalize myself, but to share my life, my experience, the great things about my own childhood, and to try to do it better in some ways. I'd like to give that to someone. I'd love to adopt. I can't for a number of reasons. People like to tell me I should be happy with my life as it is and not try to get pregnant again. I hope I someday learn to do what they are suggesting.)