Freethought & Rationalism Archive

tgamble · 03-04-2003, 01:25 PM

However, we quickly discovered that our rejection of the science in "creation science" caused students supporting that position to take our criticism as an attack on their religious beliefs. To quote one student, "It is bad enough that you teach the earth is old; you should not be able to attack my evidence that the earth is young." When these students felt their faith was under siege, they often reverted to nonscientific accusations, such as "evolution is a religion" or "it is only a theory". To a teacher, it is humbling to see students in the midst of gaining critical thinking skills revert to such tactics.

http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/rnc...12_30_1899.asp

Sure, the good guys won but such statements are just plain sad. :boohoo: :boohoo:

Albion · 03-04-2003, 02:17 PM

The PBS Evolution series had the same sort of student-driven demand for equal time ("we want science class to present both theories and let us make up our minds" - as if their minds weren't already firmly made up in favour of Goddidit). The thing that struck me was the utter despair of the science teacher afterwards; she was blaming herself for being an inadequate teacher if those kids had all managed to grab the wrong end of the stick where the scientific method and evolution are concerned. This is only going to result in good, dedicated biology teachers leaving teaching in droves because they can't compete with the creationist propaganda machine (which has the advantage of being available to kids at church and Sunday School right from when they're babes in arms, as also shown in the Evolution programme when Ken Ham went to a church meeting to preach anti-evolution rubbish), even though the creationist propaganda machine has very little to do with science.

I wondered at the time where those kids suddenly got the bright idea to take it upon themselves to demand to be taught creationism; I assumed their churches had had something to do with it, but the notion of a creationist teacher seems somewhat more likely, although why a teacher wasn't fired for preaching Christianity in a public school after receiving a warning is an interesting matter.

B. H. Manners · 03-04-2003, 09:54 PM

You guys just don't get it. these students know the truth!

Jehovah ate too many big bowls of Colon Blow cereal back in 4004 BC and what he shit out became us.

Nickle · 03-04-2003, 10:39 PM

That explains my green tint.

Doubting Didymus · 03-04-2003, 10:39 PM

Manners!

Manners, Manners.

Vorhis the Wolf · 03-05-2003, 05:23 AM

quoted from the linked article:

Quote:

STUDENT-DRIVEN CREATIONISM
Contrary to our expectations, the entire initiative to add creationism to the curriculum was student-driven; no adult took an obvious role. We know from talking with students that one of our chemistry teachers offered a great deal of support for the creationist view. In the past, he had spent the first several weeks of school preaching the creationist dogma; he appeared to have stopped because of administrative pressure, but he recently started preaching in his classroom again. The inspiration from this one adult may have been the reason this creationist action happened or it may truly have been a student-initiated response to our effective teaching of evolution. Our superintendent holds this latter opinion. He feels that creationist parents and students are upset because we teach evolution effectively.

THE CRUSADE
The school�s Christian Club served as the springboard for the initiative. These students organized and obtained hundreds of student signatures and dozens of faculty signatures on a petition requesting that "creation science" be added to the biology curriculum. We found that even among faculty the claim "It is only fair that both sides be presented" was very compelling (even 2 of our 16 science staff signed the petition). The chemistry teacher�s signature was missing.

This is a prime example of why adults are in charge and kids arent. These children have displayed a gross amount of bovine stupidity by passing around a petition to tell the administration what they want to be taught. Subjects taught in school arent decided by comitee,and creation is so nonscientific that it ranks right up there with alien abductions on the credibility scale. Next they will pass around a petition asking to have sex ed replaced by a class called "Sex is Sin".

The fact that the schools "Christian club" initiated the pettittion is even worse. Christianity on the whole has a bad habit of embraceing ignorance. Look at how they thought that the world was flat, the sun went around the earth, and that there were real witches. Things like that do not make for a fantastic intelectual track record. IMHO the 2 science teachers that sighned the petition should be fired. If they went through enough college to be science teachers and still believe in creation then they have some serious issues with denial.

abe smith · 03-05-2003, 07:21 AM

.... our Employee who is neither a gahd nor an emperor, G W Bush, a graduate of Yale University, they say, is reported to have announced recently that he *does not* believe in Evolution; he thinks 'the jury is still out". And if you want to feel even worse, connect to any of several recent polls (It depends on WHO does the polling!) and find out what your fellow-countrymen believe(in). Let's build ourselves an island & start a Country.

Jan Haugland · 03-05-2003, 07:30 AM

Vorhis,

Quote:

Look at how they thought that the world was flat, the sun went around the earth, and that there were real witches.

The Christian church never taught that the earth was flat. It is pretty important to not repeat that commonly believed falsehood.

- Jan

...who rants and raves every day at Secular Blasphemy

Shadowy Man · 03-05-2003, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by abe smith
he thinks 'the jury is still out".

And.. uh.. who's on that jury?

S2Focus · 03-05-2003, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shadowy Man
And.. uh.. who's on that jury?

That would be the OJ jury, methinks...

03-04-2003, 01:25 PM	#1
tgamble Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: St. John's, Nfld. Canada Posts: 1,652	Only read this if you WANT to be depressed. However, we quickly discovered that our rejection of the science in "creation science" caused students supporting that position to take our criticism as an attack on their religious beliefs. To quote one student, "It is bad enough that you teach the earth is old; you should not be able to attack my evidence that the earth is young." When these students felt their faith was under siege, they often reverted to nonscientific accusations, such as "evolution is a religion" or "it is only a theory". To a teacher, it is humbling to see students in the midst of gaining critical thinking skills revert to such tactics. http://www.ncseweb.org/resources/rnc...12_30_1899.asp Sure, the good guys won but such statements are just plain sad. :boohoo: :boohoo:

03-05-2003, 07:21 AM	#7
abe smith Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: springfield, MA. USA Posts: 2,482	UNFORTUNATELY .... our Employee who is neither a gahd nor an emperor, G W Bush, a graduate of Yale University, they say, is reported to have announced recently that he does not believe in Evolution; he thinks 'the jury is still out". And if you want to feel even worse, connect to any of several recent polls (It depends on WHO does the polling!) and find out what your fellow-countrymen believe(in). Let's build ourselves an island & start a Country.

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03-04-2003, 02:17 PM	#2
Albion Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: US east coast. And www.theroyalforums.com Posts: 2,829	The PBS Evolution series had the same sort of student-driven demand for equal time ("we want science class to present both theories and let us make up our minds" - as if their minds weren't already firmly made up in favour of Goddidit). The thing that struck me was the utter despair of the science teacher afterwards; she was blaming herself for being an inadequate teacher if those kids had all managed to grab the wrong end of the stick where the scientific method and evolution are concerned. This is only going to result in good, dedicated biology teachers leaving teaching in droves because they can't compete with the creationist propaganda machine (which has the advantage of being available to kids at church and Sunday School right from when they're babes in arms, as also shown in the Evolution programme when Ken Ham went to a church meeting to preach anti-evolution rubbish), even though the creationist propaganda machine has very little to do with science. I wondered at the time where those kids suddenly got the bright idea to take it upon themselves to demand to be taught creationism; I assumed their churches had had something to do with it, but the notion of a creationist teacher seems somewhat more likely, although why a teacher wasn't fired for preaching Christianity in a public school after receiving a warning is an interesting matter.

03-04-2003, 09:54 PM	#3
B. H. Manners Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Texas Posts: 1,213	You guys just don't get it. these students know the truth! Jehovah ate too many big bowls of Colon Blow cereal back in 4004 BC and what he shit out became us.

03-04-2003, 10:39 PM	#4
Nickle Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Texas Posts: 385	That explains my green tint.

03-04-2003, 10:39 PM	#5
Doubting Didymus Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: East Coast. Australia. Posts: 5,455	Manners! Manners, Manners.

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