Mad Kally

I'm getting a very spooky feeling because I just realized I have a red car and a red screwdriver. The ink pen I use to write notes next to my computer is RED!

I turned the TV off, it was scaring me. I kept hearing Seraphim talking to me about demons. <shudder>

Seraphim

By LadyShea

It is my business because this is a public forum and I have been reading this thread. You seem to me to keep moving the goal post...one minute you say there are NO coincidences, the next you say there are no coincidences when human emotions are involved or something (still don't know what you mean).

My reply : My opinion is only ONE - I don't believe in coincidence. And I don't give a shit whether anyone accept or not. It is my opinion.

As for the rest of what you heard/read, I have no recollection of saying anything like what you mentioned. I believe you may have misunderstood what you read (Surprise! ) so I have no obligation whatsoever to straighten that for you. You think you're smart, then straighten it yourself.

All humans are capable of the same emotions

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I wish your example of mothers having psychic powers were true...because I also predict a child will be murdered in the United States this week, a child will be kidnapped this month, a child will walk into the street and be killed by a car tomorrow...

My question : I have only ONE question for you, Are you Lobstrosity? YES OR NO.

The rest is irrelevant since I have already state I don't deal with multinicks or multple personalities either.

Viti

No, I am not Lobstrosity. I am jumping into this thread late, but I am a veteran user and former moderator. You and I had a discussion in October about energy and you refused to answer my simple questions in regards to your assertions. I am beginning to believe there may be a language barrier, and I apologize for butting in and jumping off topic...please forgive me.

Now, do you have any response to the parts of my post that were actually on topic?

Seraphim

LadyShea No, I am not Lobstrosity. I am jumping into this thread late, but I am a veteran user and former moderator. You and I had a discussion in October about energy and you refused to answer my simple questions in regards to your assertions. I am beginning to believe there may be a language barrier, and I apologize for butting in and jumping off topic...please forgive me.

Now, do you have any response to the parts of my post that were actually on topic?

My reply : I didn't answer your question about energy? Hmm ... can't remember the question. You remember the question?

I will answer your statement, but I will still hold on to Lobstrosity and his example of that coins flipping he like to push into other people's face so much.

All humans are capable of the same emotions

Anger
Happiness
Sadness
Boredom
etc

and of course all of them run a spectrum of intensity.

Humans also convey emotions in a multitude of physical ways, facial expression, body posture, voice tone, etc. Some people are very good at "reading" these cues and can appear psychic...it's called cold reading.

My reply : Acceptable as basic of argument but it will not be sufficient. If you think you can predict what a person says by looking at his/her facial changes alone, then you are sadly mistaken.

There are some who can control their facial appearance and even their tones and other bodily expressions. He or she doesn't get surprise (usually eyes will pop up, or slight change on the faces etc) as easily as other. Even so he is surprised, he will remain unattached to it by thinking logically.

Also those with fair skins can be easier to determine their emotion by seeing their facial difference - like whether they are blushing or reddened by anger or face turn pale by shock etc. You should try on a bit dark skinned (compared to an US white male) person such as myself who lived most of the time in warmer climate.

So, in another word, Cold-reading cannot be used on everyone. You cannot determine a person's emotions simply by popping a message and seeing his face or body movement. The worse you can possibly get is someone who stare back at you like a zombie or someone's mind is floating somewhere on space.

Also, we have a startling number of common events...I predict someone on this board will be involved in a car accident this month, I predict someone on this board will become a parent this year, I predict someone on this board will have a fight with their significant other tomorow...and on and on. I am not psychic, I am basing predictions on the probabilities that arise out of the shared human experience.

My reply : And when everyone in this forum escape this month without some sort an accident, then what? Coincidence? If someone DO had an accident, then what? Coincidence again?
IF that is your view, I will not say anything because there is nothing to say, is there?

I wish your example of mothers having psychic powers were true...because I also predict a child will be murdered in the United States this week, a child will be kidnapped this month, a child will walk into the street and be killed by a car tomorrow...

My reply : What about your child? You dare to predict something will happen to her?

Shadowy Man

It matters because I asked you what you thought.

Since you don't want to give an answer, it appears you aren't actually interested in a dialogue.

Take care...

Viti

Yes, I remember the question...in that thread you had asserted that it is possible to transfer "energy" from one person to another. Others had argued that our "energy" comes from physical process in the body and only heat can be transferred and you said more than heat is transferred. I asked "If we can transfer some sort of life essential energy, can we save a starving person by massaging them?"

There are very few people who cannot be cold read to some extent...when faced with these people "psychics" will simply not try to read them or say "I've lost the connection" or somehow NOT be psychic with those people.

I still predict a member of this board will be involved in a car accident this month. This is not coincidence, it is PROBABILITY...several thousand members who drive daily..it is HIGHLY probable one or more will be involved in a car accident on a fairly regular basis, therefore it is an easily "predictable" occurance

I don't have children, I was simply demonstrating to you that thousands of children are killed and hurt every day...why don't their mother's innate psychic abilities predict this so the kids can be protected?

Nowhere357

There is miscommunication going on here. Seraphim is just exploring, and I don't think his eyes are closed. The invective is just making it worse. Part of the problem of course is all these slippery words, and the lack of precise definitions.
I think the basic non-theistic starting point is "the natural universe is everything that exists". The word supernatural then means "things that don't exist". And psycic powers are supernatural. HOWEVER newcomers might think more like this: "the natural universe is the physical universe, and the word supernatural means non-physical (powers) stuff - some of which could be true". And psycic means non-physical (powers). (I am sure there are many other initial views.)
Hence the miscommunication. For example Seraphim meant (I think) the yellow car and screwdriver example, to show how a supposedly psycic ability (the spooky feeling) was actually explainable as a natural thing! He agrees with the skeptic view on that, but was told that was wrong, by the skeptics.

Anyway, the psycic ability which impresses me the most is the "hunters sense". I think there is a lot of anecdotal evidence from hunters etc. : don't stare at the target, hair on the back of the neck, you can sense when you are being stared at. And even that can be explained as sub-conscious cues.
So yeah, evidence. For that we need tests, and it would help to know what we're looking for, right? So it's okay to think about things psycic. That does't imply "belief in the supernatural".

That's my two cents worth, in defense of all rookie non-phd explorers everywhere.

Viti

I am going to take this a step further as I was thinking about it in the shower and do a mock psychic reading here (anyone see the South Park where Stan or Kyle did a "psychic shootout" with John Edwards?)


LadyShea-Highly Gifted Psychic-will be represented in blue
LadyShea-Skeptic-will remain in black

Hello seeker of knowledge, you wish some guidance from the spirits? Please know that I am but the messenger, your personal benevolent spirit will give me symbols and knowledge about you. Some of these symbols are meant for you only and I will not presume to intepret them, but you will know exactly what they mean. Please close your eyes for a moment, surround yourself with white light, and ask your personal spirit to join us and protect us from mischevious spirits. This may be your guardian angel, spirit guide or a person special to you who has passed to the other side...you do not need to specify, the correct spirit will answer.

Okay...a true believer will not blink an eye. They will feel special and accept this nonsense. A person seeking a psychic reading is usually desperate for guidance or comfort. Skeptics will rarely bother to pay money or waste time on such things.

I see change, great change in your life....

This is a great opener and I have seen it used time and time again. "Change" is so ambiguous...you would be hard pressed to find a person who is not in a state of transition. They may be starting school, graduating, getting married, getting divorced, about to have a baby, about to have a child start school or leave home, recently lost a job, recently started or about to start a new job, moving or recently moved, recently started or ended a relationship and on and on. This is life, it is messy.

If by chance you have come across someone whose life is so static and boring NOTHING is changing, then they are usually desperate for a change and will get very excited...they will intepret many things as being a verification of the reading's accuracy for the next few weeks.

Most believers will, at this point, chime in and give the reader more than enough information to continue the reading.
"Oh yes, I am getting married next month...how did you know?"
"Oh, I am so glad because I am in such a rut"
You get the picture...

This is a time of great spiritual and emotional growth for you, your spirit guide is very excited for you, but warns it may be difficult at times. Your spirit assures me everything will work out for the best and not to worry...many on the other side are watching out for and protecting you

This is a rip off of the "God's beautiful plan..." argument Christians use to justify any event, no matter how nasty, as "for the greater good"

Do I really need to go on...this is easy, and even easier when you have a TRUE believer as they will do their own intepreting in their head...If I say "I see the letter M", they will immediately scan their personal life for the letter M...it is a common starting letter for American names and it is HIGHLY PROBABLE the letter will hold meaning for them...in other words...the reader doesn't do anything, the person being read does all of their own intepreting.

Mad Kally

If they don't get a hit on the M they will keep right on going real fast. Maybe it's a J or a B, until someone says "Oh that's my uncle!" haha

Lobstrosity

Seraphim, were you by any chance dropped on your head as a child? Seriously, what the hell is wrong with you?

You: I believe in no coincidences.
Me: Well I can demonstrate that coincidences can clearly happen.
You: But can you flip emotions?
Me: WTF?

[deleted insult] I think I'm through talking to you until you can figure out how to actually construct arguments, learn to show others respect, and figure out how a motherfucking forum is supposed to work. If you want a private conversation with me, PM me, [deleted insult]. Otherwise, I hope you understand that ANYONE is free to respond to anything you publicly post without being ME. Similarly, if you don't have enough brain power to understand and respond appropriately to someone else's post, I will correct you. Deal with it.