Fred Flintstonensis

If the moderator thinks that this is not appropriate, then that is fine, but I think that given the fact that Radorth is a troll, I think that a specific case should be made against him.

If you read the thread "What were the Framers definitions of Separation" started by Radorth, you will find many instances of Me, Toto and other members and visitors of the board busting Radorth for his dishonesty. Notice also the silence coming from his corner after we catch him repeatedly 'playing dirty pool', quoting us out of context and employing fallacy of logic after fallacy of logic, then accusing us of these things. When we challenge him to back up his accusations, there is again silence on his part.

I say that this thread should become nothing less than an indictment of Radorth. His face needs to be rubbed in the shit of his dishonesty.

Tops on my list is his need to hold me to my now infamous misstatement. Look how many times he brought that up, after I modified it he still kept bringing up the earlier, unmodified misstatement. Why? Well because obviously, he could not handle the pure truth of the modified version.

If the moderator decides that this is a worthy thread, then please post away. Let's quote Radorth and show his dishonesty. Maybe he wil then grow up and learn to debate honestly.

Radorth

Gee. 100% ad hom in the first post.

This doesn't bode well for a "higher forum."

Rad

ybnormal

It is only the millions of folks like Radorth, who are the "legs" upon which the Bartons of the world are able to spread their manufactured lies. Rad did not come up with this American history rewrite idea, but he has refined it to an art form, and like I said before, "Everyone's good at something." He's no different than some Kansas farmer with a third grade education coming here to splain The Second Law of Thermodynamics to us after hearing his minister splain it to him one Sunday morning. It's all about schools and prayer in schools and SYATP and putting God back in schools and the politics and public opinion needed to make all that happen in their Reborn Christian Nation. Radorth hasn't a clue how "The Wall" is meant to protect him, and he doesn't care.

Daggah

If you actually knew what an ad hominem was, (you've shown utter cluelessness regarding logical fallacies of any kind, unless one counts your skill at committing them) you'd know this isn't one. It isn't saying you're wrong because you're a liar. Fred is just saying you're a liar.

Which is true, by the way.

Toto

This has gotten off on the wrong foot already.

Please feel free to list specific things Rad has said that you wish to challenge.

Please note that Rad has already thumbed his nose at you. Note also that Rad's misstatements have been repeatedly exposed, but it doesn't slow him down a bit. Note that any small mistake you make will be remembered and repeated and amplified. Conclude from this that Rad has no shame. Rubbing his nose in it will not work.

Note that Rad will take everything you say that is in the least insulting and throw it back at you, whether or not that makes any sense. ("Automatons" comes to mind.)

So - no insults. Cold dry facts, checked out before hand.

You may walk 20 feet from each other, turn, and begin firing.

Radorth

Well feel free to list specific things Rad said.

That was only 50% ad hom, and 50% palm reading. There is hope for this thread!

OK FF, I shouldn't have quoted you as saying "all those people who said he wasn't a Christian." I apologize.

Now, where else did I misquote either of you? I take almost everything atheists say at face value and quote them verbatim. There's always plenty of contradictory thinking to point to. No need to cheat and make up quotes like Buffman does.

I have never once inserted ellipses in a post as Toto did the other day, have I? Which is why I assume he's making a big deal out of it.

Fred on the other hand, sometimes doesn't even bother quoting me. He just makes up stuff he thinks I'm really saying but don't want to.

But this thread is typical of what people do who are the biggest offenders themselves, and who can't handle even the smallest offense.

You guys would fold up in one week if you were in my place.

Rad

Amie

Fred Flinstonensis
whats your problem? why start a thread in an antagonistic manner? Is it your intention to provoke? seems so. This type of thread is unfair to any poster and says absolutely nothing about Radorth but speaks volumes of you.

Toto

Radorth has the "gift" of being able to provoke people into this sort of antagonism. It can be an effective tactic - get your opponent so spluttering mad that they lash out in fury and miss the intended target.

If you are going to debate effectively, you have to get beyond this.

For example, in his last post Rad said:

"I have never once inserted ellipses in a post as Toto did the other day, have I? Which is why I assume he's making a big deal out of it. "

Let's deconstruct this lunacy. Rad says he has never once inserted ellipses in a post. But - just before saying this, he listed four disjointed phrases from my post. Why didn't he put in ellipses? Did he miss that part of 8th grade English where the teacher explained that you use ellipses to indicate that you have left out some words?

Then he says that I am making a big deal out of it - but he is the one mentioning it, not me. He is even mentioning it after I showed him his original statement, the excerpt that I made, and challenged him to show how his meaning had been in any way changed or distorted.

So how can you have a rational dialogue with someone like this? You can't. His object is not to make a persuasive rational argument for his position. But I don't actually know what his purpose is - it may be to waste our time, or to obfuscate the issues and claim victory in front of onlookers who haven't actually followed the debate but notice a lot of activity on his part. Or even worse, notice others attacking him angrily and wonder what poor widdle Radorth did to have all those meanies ganging up on him.

So do not give him that satisfaction.

Buffman

I have come to believe that Radorth is an asset to these forums for two primary reasons.

First, he is a perfect example of all those things that make his form of Christianity so unflattering and even unsavory. He is the perfect example to confirm, to all who read his posts, every negative allegation/inference made about radicial Christians. He does a better job demonstrating the shortcomings and irrationality of his form of Christianity than could any non-believer.

Second, because of his conditioned, blind faith beliefs and lack of scholarly skills, he is the perfect shill for those that wish to expose the propaganda of the far right. I have personally gained a great deal of accurate knowledge tracking down his revisionist history and personal opinion posts about what is, or is not, factually accurate knowledge.

I think it would be a shame to censure him for being what he can't help being. He does his chosen supernatural faith beliefs a greater disservice than anyone I have encountered via these forums in a very long time. No matter how many times he has been advised of this, he is impervious to the wisdom of such alerts and continues along his "blinkered" course of action seemingly oblivious to how much damage he is really doing to his personal beliefs. I now believe that he should be encouraged to continue with this destructive and self-defeating pattern.

To paraphrase Churchill, "Never have so few, done so much, to expose and undermine their own belief system."

Amie

Hi Toto
I am not familiar with Radorth's posts but a thread opened with this intent:

does not seem fair to...to anyone.
just my opinion.