Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Marlowe · 02-25-2003, 10:53 AM

Gnosticism, Kabbalah, Sufism, Hermeticism � all are representative systems of Western mysticism. What are opinions of these traditions around here and why do so many discussions focus exclusively on the rational traditions of Western religion as opposed to the esoteric traditions?

Toto · 02-25-2003, 11:20 AM

What do you mean by "rational"? I think of them as pseudo-rational.

Marlowe · 02-25-2003, 12:54 PM

They are pseudo-rational. Rational materialists usually discount them because they fall apart at some point or another when subjected to logical analysis so I'm interested in why religionists feel the need to play on rationality's field and why rational materialists ignore mystical traditions in religion.

Toto · 02-25-2003, 03:21 PM

Rationalists don't necessarily ignore the esoteric tradition. You will find non-believing people on these boards with a variety of attitudes. But Esoterics usually spend more time practicing and don't like to engage in debates, while Christian apologists do, so we find more Christian apologists coming here looking for a fight.

This Sunday I am going to a book lecture by the author of this book:

Rational Mysticism: Dispatches from the Border Between Science and Spirituality by John Hogan

LA Times book review

Jobar · 02-26-2003, 06:25 AM

I wish that we did get more mystics, of all traditions, here. We do have some- in a way, I am one (though my own is more Eastern, viewed from a Western perspective.) So is Amos, I think.

Marlowe · 02-26-2003, 10:01 AM

Thanks, Toto - I'm working on a treatise on rational mysticism myself which is why I brought it up. I'll have to check out that book. Cool!

02-25-2003, 10:53 AM	#1
Marlowe Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Little Rock Posts: 51	Western Mysticism Gnosticism, Kabbalah, Sufism, Hermeticism � all are representative systems of Western mysticism. What are opinions of these traditions around here and why do so many discussions focus exclusively on the rational traditions of Western religion as opposed to the esoteric traditions?

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02-25-2003, 11:20 AM	#2
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	What do you mean by "rational"? I think of them as pseudo-rational.

02-25-2003, 12:54 PM	#3
Marlowe Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Little Rock Posts: 51	They are pseudo-rational. Rational materialists usually discount them because they fall apart at some point or another when subjected to logical analysis so I'm interested in why religionists feel the need to play on rationality's field and why rational materialists ignore mystical traditions in religion.

02-25-2003, 03:21 PM	#4
Toto Contributor Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: Los Angeles area Posts: 40,549	Rationalists don't necessarily ignore the esoteric tradition. You will find non-believing people on these boards with a variety of attitudes. But Esoterics usually spend more time practicing and don't like to engage in debates, while Christian apologists do, so we find more Christian apologists coming here looking for a fight. This Sunday I am going to a book lecture by the author of this book: Rational Mysticism: Dispatches from the Border Between Science and Spirituality by John Hogan LA Times book review

02-26-2003, 06:25 AM	#5
Jobar Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: secularcafe.org Posts: 9,525	I wish that we did get more mystics, of all traditions, here. We do have some- in a way, I am one (though my own is more Eastern, viewed from a Western perspective.) So is Amos, I think.

02-26-2003, 10:01 AM	#6
Marlowe Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Little Rock Posts: 51	Thanks, Toto - I'm working on a treatise on rational mysticism myself which is why I brought it up. I'll have to check out that book. Cool!

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