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Old 03-24-2002, 12:55 AM   #21
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I think genetic engineering will be the next big shift in evolution. In fact, it's already started in vegetables. Remember, you can change the genes for pretty much anything if you can change them for humans.

Early single-celled organisms could swap, steal, and give DNA to one another. Evolution was very different. At some point, organisms gained genetic stability. Maybe genetic engineering will be phase 3.

Say there was a global thermonuclear catastrophe. Would EVERYONE die? I would think that there would be 1)people in space, 2)people in shelters, and 3)people who are just biologically endowed enough to survive.

-Mike
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Old 03-24-2002, 06:23 AM   #22
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Survival by migration is a concept I've always liked. I read a book by Modessit once about a civilization whose core purpose is to get humanity colonized on as many planets as possible so no one catastrophe could possibly wipe us out. In order to be really effective, though, we'd have to take it beyond Mars. All the life in the solar system could still be destroyed by a wandering black hole or a gamma ray burst from a nearby star. For the human race to really survive by migration we'd have to go to another sun.
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Old 03-24-2002, 10:10 AM   #23
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If we ever find an inexhaustible source of energy, we can all just drift through space for eternity...

Personally, I think that the future of humanity will be so genetically diverse that speciation will take place. I envision a Tolkeinistic world, in which most the offspring of humanity have degenerated into superstitious and twisted creatures, and those who still have the technological advantage will be mistaken, understandably, for wizards or mages. This may sound ridiculous, but humanity on the whole IS degenerating and speciation does not take all that long (under certain conditions); if there is a thermonuclear war, or something along the lines, it could happen. Of course, that would only be on one of many planets we will colonize .
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Old 03-24-2002, 11:01 AM   #24
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may sound ridiculous, but humanity on the whole IS degenerating
An interesting assertion. It woulod be even more interesting if you substantiated it.

[ March 24, 2002: Message edited by: Rimstalker ]</p>
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Old 03-24-2002, 05:08 PM   #25
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Wait, that notion came from an argument that I had with a pastor a while back. I ignored it because it wasn't really relevant to the discussion.
I agree, it would be interesting to see that substantiated. Natural selection no longer necessarily applies to humanity, but I don't know whether we are necessarily degenerating.
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Old 03-24-2002, 07:33 PM   #26
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Swan-eater, You have hit on one of the core ideas of my SF novel. I am stuck on the mid-section of book two. The political issues are my conceptual problem at the moment. The Gnomes (General NOrMals that is) have receded too far to be influential.

Does this really belong in this forum?
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Old 03-25-2002, 05:39 AM   #27
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Some people just kill off characters that have become useless to the plot, or find a way to bench them until they can be used again. If you ever get the book published, I want to hear of it.
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Old 03-25-2002, 08:09 AM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by three4jump:
<strong>There are many different plans for colonizing Mars. The one I'm most familiar with is Robert Zubrin's "The Case For Mars: ThePlan To Settle The Red Planet and Why We Must." I personally plan to live on Mars, hopefully by 2020. Whether we get to Mars in 2020 or 2050, it will be a tenuous foothold either way.</strong>
Have you ever read Kim Stanley Robinson's Mars series? Red Mars, Blue Mars, Green Mars (iirc)

I agree wholeheartedly with the benefit and even need to colonize off planet (and have since I was a kid). The disappointing thing is that the technology is and has been 'close enough' to achieve this and it appears that it is not being pursued.

I busted my butt on the X-33 program only to find it bogged down by factors unrelated to technology. NASA's flip-flop from high risk tech pursuits to safety above all else after the Challenger accident, pressure to highly team technical pursuits without adequate management to corral the science and build a productive environment and at the end, simple financial pressures in the face of recent failures and cost overruns on other programs.

At this point in time, under our current space development environment we are too many years away from real interplanet manned space flight.

A few of us were itchin' to take our 2001 proposal and email it to Bill Gates or Paul Allen or perhaps those wealthy Walmart folks. If I had 40 billion dollars, I'd be willing to spend a couple billion having my very own space plane.

I sincerely hope this changes soon and you can make the move.
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Old 03-25-2002, 09:31 AM   #29
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I can't believe we can't scrounge up a measly little $10 billion to go to Mars. That's just $100 per household, and I'm sure that we spend that much on potato chips each year. Even though we have the technology to get there now, I'm hoping the costs will come down even farther with better technology.

I know one way that the costs could be reduced to one tenth of all the current plans: make it a one way trip. All of the current plans have to take equipment and (sometimes) fuel for the return trip. Once I got to Mars, why the hell would I want to come back?

Edited to add:
I've been meaning to read the Robinson trilogy. I've heard they are realistic and thought-provoking.

[ March 25, 2002: Message edited by: three4jump ]</p>
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Old 03-25-2002, 12:39 PM   #30
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Here are some books that talk about the future of human evolution:
Beyond the Fall of Night, Arthur C. Clarke & Gregory Benford
Galaxies like grains of Sand, Brian Aldiss
The Endymion series has humans evolving into two species, regular humans and the genetically engineered, space adapted " Outers" with tails and prehensile feet and special adaptation for low gravity
I've read those. One that I have'nt read but is considered a classic is First Men and Last Men, Olaf Stapleton.
For non- human evolution, you can look at:
David Brin, The Uplift War,a series where
humans through bioengineering "uplift" chimpanzees and dolphins to full sentience.
there is also "Planet of the Apes" and Clifford Simak's " City" in which dogs inherit the earth( I like that notion).
Finally, you can go back to the grandaddy of all novels that treat future evolution, HG Wells'
"Time Machine",which has recently done as a movie for the second time. It was a pretty decent movie-till the usual stupid, overblown Hollywood ending...
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