Freethought & Rationalism Archive

dk · 10-16-2002, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Toto:


dk - either you are a troll, or you have a very bizarre sense of humor, or you are operating on some other plane of existence. But I am not about to wade through that volume of crypto-theological discussion of post-modernist Critical Navel Gazing to find out.

Ok, here's the short version. In secular history there are several critical factions, and the only thing they agree upon is that Christians speak transitional moonshine. The Scopes Monkey Trial is a great demonstration of revisionist history, where history suffers in proportion to the sensibilities of critical secular historians. The same is true of Vietnam, Cold War, JFK, MLK, Women's Lib and the Middle East.

dk · 10-16-2002, 03:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Toto:


dk - I have to admit that I sometimes can't seem to follow what you are saying, but this is manifestly untrue. Lots of Christians practice secular history, and when anti-Christian statements are made, they can respond and correct any errors that they can correct using secular sources and methods.

On the other hand, the Pope or an archbishop could not argue in a public school against a secular history book by showing that the author's work was on the Index and should not be read, or that the author had been excommunicated for false theological doctrines. That would be imposing theology on the study of history.

Do you get the difference? If not, I don't know what else to say.

[ October 16, 2002: Message edited by: Toto ]

You many not like it but history and theology are intertwined subjects. Western Civilization can't understand itself much less others absent a grasp of rudimentary myths, religions and philosoophy that unite people as nations, ethnics, tribes and families.

[ October 16, 2002: Message edited by: dk ]

galiel · 10-16-2002, 07:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Toto:

Lots of Christians practice secular history

Young Man: Hey, old man--how do I get to the Carnegie Foundation?

Old Man: Practice secular history.

(sorry, I just couldn't resist inflicting my weird sensibility on this otherwise sober thread)

dk · 10-21-2002, 04:31 AM

Quote:

Toto: dk - I have to admit that I sometimes can't seem to follow what you are saying, but this is manifestly untrue. Lots of Christians practice secular history, and when anti-Christian statements are made, they can respond and correct any errors that they can correct using secular sources and methods.

On the other hand, the Pope or an archbishop could not argue in a public school against a secular history book by showing that the author's work was on the Index and should not be read, or that the author had been excommunicated for false theological doctrines. That would be imposing theology on the study of history.

Do you get the difference? If not, I don't know what else to say.

dk: You�ve conceived of religious and secular history as mutually exclusive, separate and distinct without reference points. To understand Western Civilization without Christianity, Judaism and Islam places a student of history in a cave of shadows. The same is true of Eastern or Native American History. I have pointed out that secular history warps or deprives historical events of their full context, therefore are pretext.

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