sanshaj

I've always been an atheist but only engaged in it's defence recently. I was surprised by the "You don't know everything so you can't be an atheist" rebuttal.

My question is: is a belief, incorrectly held, not a belief? How does one argue that you cannot hold a belief that is incorrect? How does any inability to prove the statement "God does not exist" deny my belief system?

Isn't there a difference between a belief and a fact? Why do Christians keep telling me that if God is possible then I CANNOT believe he does not exist.

Sansha.

(I am defining Atheism as believing God does not exist for the purpose of this question. I realise others may argue it is not a belief at all)

Secular Elation

Well perhaps your definition is the problem. If you look up 'atheism' in Websters dictionary, it is defined as a disbelief in gods--notice the 'disbelief.'

Just because you can't prove gods do not exist doesn't mean you can't be an atheist--not at all. In fact, if the theists cannot prove god exists, then it is logically proper to refuse to believe that they exist.

kwigibo

"...I don't believe in isms, I just believe in me"

-Ferris Bueller


wait a tick

Mad Kally

"I don't believe in God because I don't believe in Mother Goose."

--Clarence Darrow

sanshaj

Secular Elation,

I totally understand you point and I don't disgree with that definition.

I guess what I was trying to examine the implications of the Christian interpretation of atheism - ie: that it is belief in non-existence.
Does this interpretation deny the possibility of atheism as they so often claim?

Sansha.

mongrel

The burden of proof falls on those making a claim. Why anyone would believe something with little or no evidence is beyond me. So, until someone can show me evidence to the contrary, I will remain an atheist. A weak-athiest, meaning I realise I cannot honestly say "there is NO god(s)". And just because something is possible(especially something so improbable), it doesn't mean it is real. I believe no god(s) exists, but I can't know for certain.

Abraham Lincoln said something along the lines of(can't remember the exact quote):If you make a statement, without knowing whether that statement is true or false, you are guilty of a falsehood. Even if the statement accidently is true.

Somebody else might be able to give the exact quote.

pug846

Sanshaj said:

How can you incorrectly hold a belief? You either hold it or you don’t.

Well, you can certainly show that certain definitions of God are inconsistent and therefore it is irrational to believe in God. Further, your belief system includes the belief that Santa does not exist – so what?

Of course there is. I’m not really understanding your question.

Uh? Tell them that belief in Santa, or Allah is a potential belief, but that doesn’t mean it is irrational not to believe in them.

Anunnaki

I`m an atheist and the only thing to do with religion that I believe is that Christians and other religious people are dead wrong about their story books being factual. Some names and places are correct,but the rest (the important parts) are pure fiction. I`m 100% positive of this.

The Christains have no choice but to distort and belittle everything that disagrees with them as they have no other straws left to grasp at. Their views of atheism and all other things that go against their agenda should go in one ear and out the other just like the truth does with them.

Monkeybot

Yeah, I was a little thrown by that one at first. Then I realized -- I don't know every Greek myth, every Norse myth, I don't know jack about whatever the Navajos believed, and so on. Yet I don't believe in those religions, and have pretty much de facto denied their existence (after all, I don't alter my behaviour or thoughts on the possibility that Thor might care).

Sure, Zeus could be real. But the possibility is, to me, so slim that I feel comfortable saying he doesn't exist.

In the same way, I am a strong atheist with respect to the Christian god. (I.e. I don't just disbelieve, I think He doesn't exist.) I don't think I'm required to scour the entire religion just to come to that conclusion; rather, the lack of evidence for his existence seems to indicate that either he doesn't exist or doesn't exist in such a way as to affect us. (And an indifferent or uninvolved god is, IMO, not that far away from a nonexistant god.)

sansha

Pug846
Sorry, I wasn't clear.
How about this. Can I believe you are American when in fact you are Irish?

I am arguing with a person who claims that absolute knowledge is required to be an atheist.

I just can't see why and I'm sick of being told that my position is "impossible". The santa thing might help though. Thanks.

Sansha