Freethought & Rationalism Archive

JusticeMachine · 12-12-2002, 10:02 AM

If beliefs are subjective, then why believe anything at all?

If there is no right and wrong, then why constrain myself with morals?

If purpose is subjective, then there is not point in having purpose.

Philosoft · 12-12-2002, 10:09 AM

Is this your daily non-sequitur or are you going to elaborate?

Jamie_L · 12-12-2002, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by JusticeMachine:
If beliefs are subjective, then why believe anything at all?

Hard to function otherwise. In fact, I think the clinical term is "insane".

Quote:

If there is no right and wrong, then why constrain myself with morals?

Bcause life would suck if we didn't.

Quote:

If purpose is subjective, then there is not point in having purpose.

Perhaps. But that doesn't argue that purpose is objective.

Jamie

sakrilege · 12-12-2002, 02:23 PM

Do you religiously follow Leviticus??

Shadowy Man · 12-12-2002, 02:43 PM

Zadok001 · 12-12-2002, 03:28 PM

Jamie_L summed that up nicely. Beliefs may be subjective, but are you REALLY willing to live while believing nothing? If so, I've got some connections at mental hospitals, perhaps I can get you a room.

ManM · 12-12-2002, 03:34 PM

JusticeMachine,
Do you believe chocolate ice cream tastes better than vanilla? Would you consider your preference to be subjective or objective? If subjective, does that mean you should no longer prefer vanilla over chocolate (or vica versa)?

Evil Milkman · 12-12-2002, 03:48 PM

I hope you will come to believe, at least, that your opening post did not making any verifiable sense whatsoever.

<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Why believe that it's going to hurt to try to sit too close to camp fire? Why disbelieve that the next step you take will send you through a crack in the earth? I don't know, you tell me, JusticeMachine.

*edited* for screwing up the UBB code.

[ December 12, 2002: Message edited by: Evil Milkman ]</p>

Jamie_L · 12-16-2002, 05:54 AM

JusticeMachine,

Any thoughts in response? My response may have been blunt, but it was honest. While some aspects of a naturalistic worldview may not be pleasant, how we feel about them doesn't make those aspects less likely to be true.

Thoughts?

Jamie

happyboy · 12-16-2002, 06:05 AM

personally, i find my belief in God as a symbol for man's higher intellect and scientific curiosity to be a liberating thing. i don't need to have a supernatural bearded guy in the sky to make me feel fulfilled. i have ethics because that's what makes me human. animals don't really have ethics, but we DO, and that makes us above the animals. i don't need magic or heaven or hell to feel wonder and awe about the universe and it's inhabitants. i don't need a belief in an afterlife to feel safe and secure. the idea of the universe's vastness and the earth's ancient nature fill me with a greater sense of wonder and excitement than i ever felt when i was a believer.

happyboy

12-12-2002, 10:02 AM	#1
JusticeMachine Regular Member Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Arizona Posts: 403	If beliefs are subjective, then why believe anything at all? If beliefs are subjective, then why believe anything at all? If there is no right and wrong, then why constrain myself with morals? If purpose is subjective, then there is not point in having purpose.

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12-12-2002, 10:09 AM	#2
Philosoft Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Southeast of disorder Posts: 6,829	Is this your daily non-sequitur or are you going to elaborate?

12-12-2002, 02:23 PM	#4
sakrilege Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2002 Location: Cleveland, OH, USA Folding@Home Godless Team Posts: 6,211	Do you religiously follow Leviticus??

12-12-2002, 02:43 PM	#5
Shadowy Man Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Shadowy Planet Posts: 7,585

12-12-2002, 03:28 PM	#6
Zadok001 Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Two Steps Ahead Posts: 1,124	Jamie_L summed that up nicely. Beliefs may be subjective, but are you REALLY willing to live while believing nothing? If so, I've got some connections at mental hospitals, perhaps I can get you a room.

12-12-2002, 03:34 PM	#7
ManM Veteran Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: NW Florida, USA Posts: 1,279	JusticeMachine, Do you believe chocolate ice cream tastes better than vanilla? Would you consider your preference to be subjective or objective? If subjective, does that mean you should no longer prefer vanilla over chocolate (or vica versa)?

12-12-2002, 03:48 PM	#8
Evil Milkman Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Illinois Posts: 499	I hope you will come to believe, at least, that your opening post did not making any verifiable sense whatsoever. <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> Why believe that it's going to hurt to try to sit too close to camp fire? Why disbelieve that the next step you take will send you through a crack in the earth? I don't know, you tell me, JusticeMachine. edited for screwing up the UBB code. [ December 12, 2002: Message edited by: Evil Milkman ]</p>

12-16-2002, 05:54 AM	#9
Jamie_L Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: U.S. Posts: 2,565	JusticeMachine, Any thoughts in response? My response may have been blunt, but it was honest. While some aspects of a naturalistic worldview may not be pleasant, how we feel about them doesn't make those aspects less likely to be true. Thoughts? Jamie

12-16-2002, 06:05 AM	#10
happyboy Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: on the border between here and there, WV Posts: 373	personally, i find my belief in God as a symbol for man's higher intellect and scientific curiosity to be a liberating thing. i don't need to have a supernatural bearded guy in the sky to make me feel fulfilled. i have ethics because that's what makes me human. animals don't really have ethics, but we DO, and that makes us above the animals. i don't need magic or heaven or hell to feel wonder and awe about the universe and it's inhabitants. i don't need a belief in an afterlife to feel safe and secure. the idea of the universe's vastness and the earth's ancient nature fill me with a greater sense of wonder and excitement than i ever felt when i was a believer. happyboy

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