Freethought & Rationalism Archive

lcb · 08-09-2002, 05:39 PM

if we see the armies of the world gather to fight in the valley of Armageddon, would that mean anything to anybody here? would that prophecy be self-fulfilling?

Vorkosigan · 08-09-2002, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lcb:
if we see the armies of the world gather to fight in the valley of Armageddon, would that mean anything to anybody here? would that prophecy be self-fulfilling?

We're all waiting to see a list of the 10 or 15 prophecies you consider especially convincing or fulfilled. As far as anyone knows no Bible prophecies are fulfilled in the modern state of Israel.

Vorkosigan

[ August 09, 2002: Message edited by: Vorkosigan ]

lcb · 08-09-2002, 08:05 PM

<a href="http://100prophecies.org" target="_blank">http://100prophecies.org</a> i already posted this before. I pick the first ten.and you didnt answer my q. about armageddon....

Philosoft · 08-09-2002, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lcb:
<a href="http://100prophecies.org" target="_blank">http://100prophecies.org</a> i already posted this before. I pick the first ten.

The Jews are scattered worldwide?! Is this supposed to be unique? Are there no other religious peoples that have great numbers in many parts of the world?

lcb · 08-09-2002, 08:49 PM

this prophecy was written by an Algonquin american indian prophet in the l600's: soon there will come Gods in tall ships, they will come in peace, but in time they will make war, they will slaughter the indian tribes and destroy the buffalo and will conquer the land, but in the latter days the ancient tribes will revive and their ancient language will be restored and the buffalo herds will be restored and they will drive the Gods who came in tall ships out and they will reconquer their land.Book of Algonquin ,chapter 3 verses 10 thru 49.

One-eyed Jack · 08-09-2002, 11:14 PM

Armageddon: the Valley of Megiddo, located in Northern Israel, about 25 miles southwest of the Golan Heights

Your question needs some clarification: if all the armies of all the nations of the world gathered in the Valley of Megiddo then I would be troubled because the odds of that happening are relatively slim.

If you mean that some units of a few armies gather there, I would not be especially surprised.

Prophecies are funny: if you make a sufficiently vague prophecy and put no time limit on it then chances are good it will come to pass sooner or later (unless you prophesy something very unusual, like the Moon crashing into the Earth). You can visualize this easily: find yourself 4 dice and "prophesy" that when you roll them they will all come up 1. In a single roll chances are very strongly against your prophecy. But if you remove the time limit--"I prophesy that some time in the future all the dice will come up 1"--then if you keep rolling the dice long enough it's virtually certain that sooner or later all four come up 1.

[ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: One-eyed Jack ]

Babylon Sister · 08-10-2002, 02:51 AM

Icb

Do you have a link to this Book of Algonquin?

I'd like to see it, because frankly, I think this sounds a bit too much like the phoney Chief Seattle speech.

Since the Algonquin were an Eastern Woodlands tribe that lived mainly between the eastern Great Lakes and the Atlantic and north to Hudson's Bay, my guess is that they were not familiar with herds of buffalo as the "prophecy" suggests.

carnt sepll

[ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: Babylon Sister ]

Jayhawker Soule · 08-10-2002, 05:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lcb:
if we see the armies of the world gather to fight in the valley of Armageddon, would that mean anything to anybody here? would that prophecy be self-fulfilling?

As previously noted, a gathering of "the armies of the world ... to fight in the valley of Armageddon" could mean any number of things, depending on scale and scope. In his <a href="http://www.bibleinterp.com/articles/Armageddon.htm" target="_blank">Web-Based Introduction to "The Battles of Armageddon"</a>, Cline notes:

Quote:

During the past 4000 years, at least 34 bloody conflicts have already been fought at the ancient site of Megiddo and adjacent areas of the Jezreel Valley. Egyptians, Canaanites, Israelites, Midianites, Amalekites, Philistines, Hasmonaeans, Greeks, Romans, Muslims, Crusaders, Mamlukes, Mongols, French, Ottomans, British, Australians, Germans, Arabs and Israelis have all fought and died here. The names of the warring generals and leaders reverberate throughout history: Thutmose III, Deborah and Barak, Sisera, Gideon, Saul and Jonathan, Shishak, Jehu, Joram, Jezebel, Josiah, Antiochus, Ptolemy, Vespasian, Saladin, Napoleon, and Allenby, to name but a few of the most famous.

I wonder how many of these 34 conflicts you would have proclaimed as prophesy confirmed?

lcb · 08-10-2002, 10:53 AM

none of them. none of these fit the prophecy. read the book of revelation. When the "Kings of the East" have tactical nuclear weapons however....!!!! (Keep your gas tank full and have a bicycle handy..if you want some advice..you will be pushing your car to work or class!)

Kosh · 08-10-2002, 11:01 AM

Seems to me this belongs in RRP...

08-09-2002, 05:39 PM	#1
lcb Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: washington d.c. Posts: 224	Armageddon if we see the armies of the world gather to fight in the valley of Armageddon, would that mean anything to anybody here? would that prophecy be self-fulfilling?

08-09-2002, 11:14 PM	#6
One-eyed Jack Junior Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Eugene, Oregon Posts: 46	Armageddon: the Valley of Megiddo, located in Northern Israel, about 25 miles southwest of the Golan Heights Your question needs some clarification: if all the armies of all the nations of the world gathered in the Valley of Megiddo then I would be troubled because the odds of that happening are relatively slim. If you mean that some units of a few armies gather there, I would not be especially surprised. Prophecies are funny: if you make a sufficiently vague prophecy and put no time limit on it then chances are good it will come to pass sooner or later (unless you prophesy something very unusual, like the Moon crashing into the Earth). You can visualize this easily: find yourself 4 dice and "prophesy" that when you roll them they will all come up 1. In a single roll chances are very strongly against your prophecy. But if you remove the time limit--"I prophesy that some time in the future all the dice will come up 1"--then if you keep rolling the dice long enough it's virtually certain that sooner or later all four come up 1. [ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: One-eyed Jack ]</p>

08-10-2002, 02:51 AM	#7
Babylon Sister Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Wyoming Posts: 894	Icb Do you have a link to this Book of Algonquin? I'd like to see it, because frankly, I think this sounds a bit too much like the phoney Chief Seattle speech. Since the Algonquin were an Eastern Woodlands tribe that lived mainly between the eastern Great Lakes and the Atlantic and north to Hudson's Bay, my guess is that they were not familiar with herds of buffalo as the "prophecy" suggests. carnt sepll [ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: Babylon Sister ]</p>

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08-09-2002, 08:05 PM	#3
lcb Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: washington d.c. Posts: 224	<a href="http://100prophecies.org" target="_blank">http://100prophecies.org</a> i already posted this before. I pick the first ten.and you didnt answer my q. about armageddon....

08-09-2002, 08:49 PM	#5
lcb Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: washington d.c. Posts: 224	this prophecy was written by an Algonquin american indian prophet in the l600's: soon there will come Gods in tall ships, they will come in peace, but in time they will make war, they will slaughter the indian tribes and destroy the buffalo and will conquer the land, but in the latter days the ancient tribes will revive and their ancient language will be restored and the buffalo herds will be restored and they will drive the Gods who came in tall ships out and they will reconquer their land.Book of Algonquin ,chapter 3 verses 10 thru 49.

08-10-2002, 10:53 AM	#9
lcb Banned Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: washington d.c. Posts: 224	none of them. none of these fit the prophecy. read the book of revelation. When the "Kings of the East" have tactical nuclear weapons however....!!!! (Keep your gas tank full and have a bicycle handy..if you want some advice..you will be pushing your car to work or class!)

08-10-2002, 11:01 AM	#10
Kosh Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Orions Belt Posts: 3,911	Seems to me this belongs in RRP...

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