Chimp

Why not build a real size replica of Noah's Ark, and then build life size replicas of every different "kind" of animal. Including all of the extinct forms such as dinosaurs. Also, construct all of the animal replicas to be at a "young" stage of development.

Would the many thousands{millions?} of pairs of land dwelling species fit on this experimental Ark, including the insects?

:banghead:


Seriously, this could be one way to explain the impossibility or plausibility? of the Ark scenario.

Chimp

Boro Nut

Or let's not. Lets just spend two minutes working out that it's impossible on a bit of paper instead and spend the money we have saved of a really good piss up.

Boro Nut

Volker.Doormann

In many stories of the OT it is dramatized that a VIP soul descend down into a physical body (for what the symbol Egypt is standing) and is trying to return to the spiritual home. Like Moses was put in a ‘basket ‘ (Hebrew: tebah {tay-baw'} what means vessel), in the story of Noah the thing , that was filled with two parts of sexuality in an environment of water for a defined time is also named tebah ! . Out of this (dark) enclave on the first day of the tenth month (Gen 8:5) something was seen outside. As Hebrews month are month from a lunar calendar, each moon month has a length of 29.53 days, with a length of total 266.77 days for nine month and one day(of the tenth month). Today’s length of a pregnancy in middle is AFAIK discussed with 266 days.

In Jewish mysticism it is no secret, that the story of Jonah, his experiences in a fish (in a water environment) for a while and on a boat is a parable of the descent of a soul into a body (for which the boat is a symbol), lamenting he want back home. Jonah {yo-naw'} means dove and is a symbol for the descending spiritual soul. The theme of the descending and re-ascending soul is dramatized across the hole Pentateuch in mostly all stories. The story of Noah is taken direct from the Sumerian Epic of Gilgamesh (~2500 B.C.E), in that the very same spiritual theme is dramatized. These parables only make sense, if one understand the figures and elements as symbols of the own inner self. The self, that is searching in a body - born by two sexualities given in a water filled tebah/womb for nine moon month - for a sense and for answers about his own existance.

Volker

Boro Nut

I seem to remember there was already a wrecked pirate ship inside there when he got in. What is the significance of that do you know?

Chimp

Yes, there could be a metaphorical interpretation to the many stories contained within the Bible.

I am trying to understand what drives the deep need for a literal interpretation, such that people will go to any lengths, even trying to twist the facts into a 6000 year old universe scenario.

Since the Bible is part of human history, I do not wish to scoff at it , just try to understand why people need a literal interpretation.

Chimp

Volker.Doormann

I think significance depends on the own consciousness. It is different for each of us. Therefore it should be helpful to adjust the level of consciousness. In my understanding religion is a spiritual dimension, which has no significance in a physical world. Justice is not measurable in physical units. Ethic has no mass, no energy, no time and no location. All that, what is claimed by the religions which should have a physical relevance in this physical world is a fraud. Therefore it is IMO senseless to take the biblical stories as historical events with a physical significance. There is a consciousness of an own self, that ask questions. But no one is able to prove, that an own self exist, as energies exist or mass.

The very long tradition of the Jewish mysticism is - apart from xianity - to learn and to teach the stories of the Pentateuch as parables beyond physical causality, rationality and a monotone development of civilization in a timeline. Spiritual order does not depend on time or on locations. Edmund Gorden has found some proverbs from Sumerian clay tables from about 2500 B.C.E. One goes: "Who has much silver may be happy; who has much grain may be glad, but he who has nothing can sleep". I think there is no change in that insight since about 4500 years. There are some books from Aryeh Wineman: 'Ethical Tales from the Kabbalah' or 'Mystic Tales from the Zohar'. In the latter one can read on page 107: "The biblical story of Jonah is read as a parable of human experience from birth through death to resurrection and renewed life. A parable of the life of a human being in this world: Jonah, who is boarded a ship, is really the human soul who descend to this world in order to enter into the body of the person. ... A person living in this world, is like a ship in danger of being shattered in the midst of the Great sea, as it is said: 'the ship was in danger of breaking up' (Jonah 1.4) ... ". To understand the symbols of the biblical stories can help to understand the own inner self and its order, which has no physical existence. Secular religious organizations are only secular power organizations to hamper men from knowledge as Jesus has said in the Gospel of Thomas (102): "Damn the Pharisees! They are like a dog sleeping in the cattle manger: the dog neither eats nor [lets] the cattle eat."

Volker

Boro Nut

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying. I can't answer for all christians but I am pretty sure Roman Catholicism has mass at a given location, and it takes a fair bit of time and energy. I agree it has no relevance though.

Boro Nut

Volker.Doormann

I think, that there are 'things' which have physical properties, like a photon or a proton, and that there are 'things', which have not. A 'seven', logic, math, harmony, color all this has no physical properties, but still they have a special form of existence. Physical things can be localized, spiritual 'things' not. Physical things can be related to persons or owned, like a Rolex, spiritual 'things' not.

Religions claim that they are related to things or own things. If these things are physical, like a bone, it has no spiritual significance. If these things are spiritual, one can recognize, that these 'things' can't be owned and can't be related to very special persons. Who is the owner of the 'seven'? Who is the owner of the 'colors'? Who possesses math?

Some fellows can own a house in Rom, inside or outside the Vatican. A house is made of stones. But a religion can't possesses spiritual 'things'. Spiritual 'things' only can be recognized, but not possessed. Therefore is it a fraud, if religions claim, that they have and can deliver spiritual 'things' (which other haven't).

To find the order of spiritual 'things' each one himself must be aware which kind of 'things' are in question, I think.

Volker

Amos

To remove doubt and reinforce their own belief. It is the worst thing we can do because literalism (rationalism) is the cause of our alientaion from our God identity and the enemy of salvation (understanding).

Boro Nut

I'm confused. Was it Jesus who was created to bring about our salivation? Only I recall and advert claiming it was Opal Fruits.

Boro Nut