Freethought & Rationalism Archive

MOJO-JOJO · 05-23-2002, 06:53 AM

Of course, those idiots have already banned everyone that can give them a cogent answer.

So when no one responds, they'll say, "See! Even the evilutionists can't respond to this! <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

"JOHN PAUL

Here is a challenge to evolutionists: Please answer all the questions below to the best of your ability.

Could provide us with the evidence that life could originate from non-life via purely natural processes?

(HINT: there isn�t any:
<a href="http://www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm" target="_blank">http://www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm</a> )

How could that be objectively tested and falsified?

What are the alternatives if life could not have originated via purely natural processes?

Why are those alternatives un-scientific?

If abiogenesis and evolution are separate why does one theory begin where the other ends? (abiogenesis ends with the formation of progenotes and that is where the theory of evolution begins)

How could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that progenotes evolved into procaryotes?*

How could we objectively test the hypothesis that eucaryotes evolved via procaryotic endosymbiosis?*

How could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that true multi-cellularity evolved from colonies of single-celled organisms (i.e. the Volvox)?*

Or for that matter how could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that the eye could evolve?

*I asked these three questions of Ken Miller on a USA Today �chat� pertaining to the PBS series Evolution. This was his response:

quote:
�I think that the best tests in EACH of the cases you suggest have already been done. They involve careful tests of DNA sequence homology to test the
assertions that each group shares common ancestry.

And such tests have always come out in the affirmative.�

Problem is I didn�t ask for the best tests. I asked for objective tests. Homology in biology is easily evidence for a Common Creator. IOW the only way that the �tests� came out in the affirmative was because that is what the testee wanted (because any alternative was excluded a priori) and has nothing to do with objectivity.

Bottom line is the Theory of Evolution is a philosophy and should be discussed in that
venue. That is until it can be objectively tested."

Okay John Paul, how can we test that God waved his magic wand over a pile of dust and "poof!"...Adam was produced? Then how do we prove that God yanked out a rib from Adam and "poof!" Eve was made?

Oh I forgot, silly me, the proof is that in the mythological world of God and supernaturalism......no proof is neccessary because ANYthing is possible with God, and even pigs can fly out of our butts if he so wills.

Darwin's Finch · 05-23-2002, 07:01 AM

Post-"Renaissance" BaptistBoard evolution forum=fundie circle jerk.

gallo · 05-23-2002, 08:13 AM

Isn't it funny that John Paul is posting on the Baptist board. He claims that he is not a christian (any more). He has off and on claimed to be Muslim. However, his alter-ego, Hand Luke (he lost his cool) claims to be christian. They echo the same things.

daemon · 05-23-2002, 08:20 AM

Come on, people--did you actually read their forum? They're still allowing non-theists to participate. They haven't changed a thing there.

Skydancer · 05-24-2002, 03:36 AM

Puh-leeze. Nontheist =/= competent scientist. They've been systematically getting rid of anyone who can call them on that kind of BS.

Quote:

Originally posted by daemon:
Come on, people--did you actually read their forum? They're still allowing non-theists to participate. They haven't changed a thing there.

babelfish · 05-24-2002, 04:34 AM

The Baptist Board decided Preaching To The Choir was actually a GOOD thing to do

seebs · 05-24-2002, 10:24 AM

A good friend of mine applied for membership and was turned down. She's a Catholic who believes in evolution. So... They're obviously not open to anyone who doesn't agree with them.

I'm half inclined to write in and ask if they'd like me to come and share my witnessing about God's message of love and tolerance for homosexuals, but I'm guessing my application would, uhm, not be accepted.

MOJO-JOJO · 05-24-2002, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skydancer:
Puh-leeze. Nontheist =/= competent scientist. They've been systematically getting rid of anyone who can call them on that kind of BS.

Agreed. daemon's post is bunk. There are several threads and commentaries recently that have posted a long list of banned non-mythicists. Only gullible, supersticious people need apply for membership.

Like they say in Alabama..."ROLL TITHE!"

daemon · 05-24-2002, 10:53 AM

Good frigging grief people, they've never allowed anyone other than administrators to post to their E/C boards. However, they have indicated--in big red letters--that you can still write to the admins, regardless of your registration status with the board, to contribute to that forum.

Accusing them of changing things when they have deliberately and quite obviously indicated they have not is uncalled for.

Read <a href="http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000157" target="_blank">this post</a> where they indicate this is the case.

[ May 24, 2002: Message edited by: daemon ]

excreationist · 05-25-2002, 05:43 AM

That's true daemon, though they could choose not to post some non-Christians' or non-theists' posts or edit them. And people don't really have anywhere to complain (since they can't post freely to the BB) - they could complain on this board though.

05-23-2002, 06:53 AM	#1
MOJO-JOJO Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Nashville, USA Posts: 949	Arghh! Check out this post by the BB Of course, those idiots have already banned everyone that can give them a cogent answer. So when no one responds, they'll say, "See! Even the evilutionists can't respond to this! <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" /> "JOHN PAUL Here is a challenge to evolutionists: Please answer all the questions below to the best of your ability. Could provide us with the evidence that life could originate from non-life via purely natural processes? (HINT: there isn�t any: <a href="http://www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm" target="_blank">http://www.panspermia.org/rnaworld.htm</a> ) How could that be objectively tested and falsified? What are the alternatives if life could not have originated via purely natural processes? Why are those alternatives un-scientific? If abiogenesis and evolution are separate why does one theory begin where the other ends? (abiogenesis ends with the formation of progenotes and that is where the theory of evolution begins) How could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that progenotes evolved into procaryotes?* How could we objectively test the hypothesis that eucaryotes evolved via procaryotic endosymbiosis?* How could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that true multi-cellularity evolved from colonies of single-celled organisms (i.e. the Volvox)?* Or for that matter how could we objectively test and falsify the hypothesis that the eye could evolve? *I asked these three questions of Ken Miller on a USA Today �chat� pertaining to the PBS series Evolution. This was his response: quote: �I think that the best tests in EACH of the cases you suggest have already been done. They involve careful tests of DNA sequence homology to test the assertions that each group shares common ancestry. And such tests have always come out in the affirmative.� Problem is I didn�t ask for the best tests. I asked for objective tests. Homology in biology is easily evidence for a Common Creator. IOW the only way that the �tests� came out in the affirmative was because that is what the testee wanted (because any alternative was excluded a priori) and has nothing to do with objectivity. Bottom line is the Theory of Evolution is a philosophy and should be discussed in that venue. That is until it can be objectively tested." Okay John Paul, how can we test that God waved his magic wand over a pile of dust and "poof!"...Adam was produced? Then how do we prove that God yanked out a rib from Adam and "poof!" Eve was made? Oh I forgot, silly me, the proof is that in the mythological world of God and supernaturalism......no proof is neccessary because ANYthing is possible with God, and even pigs can fly out of our butts if he so wills.

05-24-2002, 10:53 AM	#9
daemon Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 737	Good frigging grief people, they've never allowed anyone other than administrators to post to their E/C boards. However, they have indicated--in big red letters--that you can still write to the admins, regardless of your registration status with the board, to contribute to that forum. Accusing them of changing things when they have deliberately and quite obviously indicated they have not is uncalled for. Read <a href="http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=36;t=000157" target="_blank">this post</a> where they indicate this is the case. [ May 24, 2002: Message edited by: daemon ]</p>

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05-23-2002, 07:01 AM	#2
Darwin's Finch Senior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Gardnerville, NV Posts: 666	Post-"Renaissance" BaptistBoard evolution forum=fundie circle jerk.

05-23-2002, 08:13 AM	#3
gallo Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Houston, TX, US Posts: 244	Isn't it funny that John Paul is posting on the Baptist board. He claims that he is not a christian (any more). He has off and on claimed to be Muslim. However, his alter-ego, Hand Luke (he lost his cool) claims to be christian. They echo the same things.

05-23-2002, 08:20 AM	#4
daemon Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2001 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 737	Come on, people--did you actually read their forum? They're still allowing non-theists to participate. They haven't changed a thing there.

05-24-2002, 04:34 AM	#6
babelfish Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Augusta, Maine, USA Posts: 2,046	The Baptist Board decided Preaching To The Choir was actually a GOOD thing to do

05-24-2002, 10:24 AM	#7
seebs Contributor Join Date: May 2002 Location: Saint Paul, MN Posts: 24,524	A good friend of mine applied for membership and was turned down. She's a Catholic who believes in evolution. So... They're obviously not open to anyone who doesn't agree with them. I'm half inclined to write in and ask if they'd like me to come and share my witnessing about God's message of love and tolerance for homosexuals, but I'm guessing my application would, uhm, not be accepted.

05-25-2002, 05:43 AM	#10
excreationist Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Australia Posts: 4,886	That's true daemon, though they could choose not to post some non-Christians' or non-theists' posts or edit them. And people don't really have anywhere to complain (since they can't post freely to the BB) - they could complain on this board though.

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