Freethought & Rationalism Archive

07-03-2003, 07:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rational BAC
Great post Amos--

--- Although I don't plan to write any Gospels anytime soon.

Now if you could write like that more often--on your longer posts, --so clearly and understandably ---maybe I and others might understand better what you are talking about.

Thanks but if your mind was like Pauls you would write your own Gospel. Point is that we cannot understand the gospel of others beyond our own experience of it and this means that the true meaning of the words must be prior to us by nature and after that we can find agreement in the bible.

Rational BAC · 07-03-2003, 07:20 PM

Can you rephrase that just a little bit Amos?

That almost made sense.

crocodile deathroll · 07-03-2003, 08:10 PM

The emotional peptides that make you feel guilty. When evolution presented us with them that is IMO when "sin" originated.

Rational BAC · 07-03-2003, 08:37 PM

I have no "emotional peptitudes" I guess.

And I do not feel guilty in any way.

You are as bad as Amos, you know.

To speak clearly is a virtue.

crocodile deathroll · 07-04-2003, 05:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rational BAC
I have no "emotional peptitudes" I guess.

And I do not feel guilty in any way.

You are as bad as Amos, you know.

To speak clearly is a virtue.

Peptides for emotion I meant to say

Rational BAC · 07-04-2003, 08:06 AM

Going to shove this up to the top because I really never got any good answers to my questions about the validity of original sin.

I am sure there have to be some theists out there who can explain original sin in any kind of way that makes some sense.

I expect atheists to just make fun of the whole concept. (I do too). Just trying to find a rational theist viewpoint on this.

Where in Bible is original sin ?---and I mean very obviously --not just very vague interpretations---------(Hell --give me vagueness and I can interpret as well as anyone to make any statement I want.)

I don't think original sin is there Biblically speaking in any kind of "in your face" sense. I don't think it was ever there or had anything at all to do with Christianity or why Jesus died on the cross.

Soul Invictus · 07-05-2003, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abe smith
Invictus, resp. to your recent inquiry for explanation. Please note that ALL THE FOLLOWING EXPLANATIONS are statements of Roman Catholic JUNK FICTIONS!
Okay: RC dogma (in the Catechism, and/via? Thos Aquinas)admits that the Incarnation and the Crucifixion/Death were NOT NECESSARY, to redeem "Man"and atone for Original Sin. (The crux -sic- of the matter.)
"God" (the fiction) COULD have absolved Man of Original Sin, and swept away its consequences, by Divine Fiat for example;
without the Incarnation , and without the Incarnated Guy's Crucifixial death & expiation. The Incarnation and the Atonement WERE NOT NECESSARY.
Roman Catholicism says that "God" CHOSE (voluntarily, of course) to do it this way; but that "He" WAS NOT (f course) REQUIRED to have done it this way.
Ask your local RC Bishop: it's his job to know & to teach you about all this >>> what he's there for.
Also, (Jewish) circumcision is NOT about atoning for sin. Circumcision is the *Sign of the Covenant* made between "God" and Abraham, forever. Ask your local Rabbi to explain this to you.

what did you want me to respond to?

Soul Invictus · 07-05-2003, 06:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Rational BAC
Going to shove this up to the top because I really never got any good answers to my questions about the validity of original sin.

I am sure there have to be some theists out there who can explain original sin in any kind of way that makes some sense.

I expect atheists to just make fun of the whole concept. (I do too). Just trying to find a rational theist viewpoint on this.

Where in Bible is original sin ?---and I mean very obviously --not just very vague interpretations---------(Hell --give me vagueness and I can interpret as well as anyone to make any statement I want.)

I don't think original sin is there Biblically speaking in any kind of "in your face" sense. I don't think it was ever there or had anything at all to do with Christianity or why Jesus died on the cross.

Magus55 - care to get in on this discussion? (if you're watching)

babelfish · 07-06-2003, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by abe smith
to get into discussion w/ Amos, because I am not competent to discuss w/ him.
Regarding this immediately-foregoing business here at this thread started by Invictus, I was attempting to answer Invictus's and BAC's specific (theological) inquiries ; and my answers to their questions were NOT statements of any opinions of my own (I think all that stuff is garbage!).
I was trying my best to tell Invictus & BAC what the Roman Catholics's explanation about all that junk is (about Original Sin, the Incarnation, the Crucifixion, the Redemption, etc. ). Hence please advise Amos NOT to start an argument w/ me about these ridiculous assertions; let him take it up w/ his local Ordinary = Bishop of the Diocese in wh/ Amos practises Catholicism.
Note that when I asked Amos recently the Demand direct, "Are you a Catholic?" he replied that Yes, he is a Catholic; and /but he doesn't (bother with) the Catechism........
*I* do not believe ANY of that trash; hence Amos need not take issue w/ me about any of it. (Thank you very much).
I advised Invictus & BAC to take their qq to their Bishop(s), if they want accurate answers. Abe

[sorry for the interruption]

Abe your mailbox is full, I can't send you any PM's.

[/sorry for the interruption]

Inconnu · 07-07-2003, 06:28 AM

May as well throw Mortal Sin into the fray! A sin from which redemtion is not possible.

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07-03-2003, 07:20 PM	#32
Rational BAC Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Tampa Bay area Posts: 3,471	Can you rephrase that just a little bit Amos? That almost made sense.

07-03-2003, 08:10 PM	#33
crocodile deathroll Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Darwin Posts: 1,466	The emotional peptides that make you feel guilty. When evolution presented us with them that is IMO when "sin" originated.

07-03-2003, 08:37 PM	#34
Rational BAC Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Tampa Bay area Posts: 3,471	I have no "emotional peptitudes" I guess. And I do not feel guilty in any way. You are as bad as Amos, you know. To speak clearly is a virtue.

07-04-2003, 08:06 AM	#36
Rational BAC Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Tampa Bay area Posts: 3,471	Going to shove this up to the top because I really never got any good answers to my questions about the validity of original sin. I am sure there have to be some theists out there who can explain original sin in any kind of way that makes some sense. I expect atheists to just make fun of the whole concept. (I do too). Just trying to find a rational theist viewpoint on this. Where in Bible is original sin ?---and I mean very obviously --not just very vague interpretations---------(Hell --give me vagueness and I can interpret as well as anyone to make any statement I want.) I don't think original sin is there Biblically speaking in any kind of "in your face" sense. I don't think it was ever there or had anything at all to do with Christianity or why Jesus died on the cross.

07-07-2003, 06:28 AM	#40
Inconnu Regular Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: here Posts: 121	May as well throw Mortal Sin into the fray! A sin from which redemtion is not possible.

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