InsideOutBoy

People, atheists in particular, have several problems with the Christian God concept. The most frequently occurring problems revolve around the morality of God. To many atheists the Christian God is an evil being and notions of hell, suffering, freewill, judgment, punishment, omniscience, lack of clear proof, are all linked to this.

So imagine for a moment you’re a good, loving, just God. You’ve just created time and space. Now you must create a new intelligent species to enter a personal, meaningful, genuine, and most importantly of all - loving (in the purest sense of the word) relationship with you. Ideally these creatures will progress to becoming your trusted assistants in the afterlife. After achieving this you, a being unimaginably far beyond the zenith of existence, must have been glorified. This is your ultimate mission.

You have unlimited resources of course. In fact the only limit is your own character - you are a perfectly good, loving, just God, and you cannot do anything that contradicts you own character. Correct all those things that you don’t like about Christianity, those which you personally feel discredit it, but the aforementioned mission remains your supreme goal at all times.


What would you do…?

phlebas

Well, in my infinite wisdom, I would realize that there is absolutely no reason at all for a God as powerful and omni-everything as I am to create a universe at all, much less a barely sentient (by comparison) limited species like mankind.

But you also said:

Now you must create a new intelligent species...

Who, in this scenario, decides what I must do?

...to enter a personal, meaningful, genuine, and most importantly of all - loving (in the purest sense of the word) relationship with you.

The purest sense. Got it. No boinking.

Looking back over my own relationships (pure or otherwise) in real life, I think there is a common thread: there was proof that I existed.

If I wanted to be fawned over by my little creations, like the Christian god seems to want, then I would make sure I was hanging out among them, replete in my glory.

Did that help?

Welcome to the SecWeb

[ April 07, 2002: Message edited by: phlebas ]</p>

Eudaimonist

If I was a good, loving, just God, I wouldn't make humans so that they would enter into a dependent, slave-like relationship with me. I would make them so they could enter into dignified, respectful, productive, rational independent-interdependent relationships with each other, and only secondarily with myself. I wouldn't require that they enter into a relationship with me at all -- I'd let them choose their friends. They would have full respect for their independence and humanity, not treated as labrats and underlings.

Ideally, they would be friends, not assistants.

Loki

Death came about via Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. How would they enter into heaven without such "fall?"

If I were god, I'd probably just let them eat of the Tree of Eternal Life.

Theli

InideOutBoy...
Welcome to the board.
As you mention the christian god, I will imagine myself with the common attributes (even if they contradict each other) associated with that god.

Hell doesn't seem like an act of justice, rather an act of hate. An act of pride, everyone who soils his perfect world or his perfect law must be eliminated.
While his actions on earth seems more like acts of apathy. He's acting like he didn't even exist at all, is it a wonder that we doubt?

"I must"?
Are my actions, as god, limited by an external plan? And can my perfect existance involve desire?

Once again... Does my perfect existance and omnipotence require assistance?
If it somehow did, why do I need humans? I would rather create other completely loyal and more powerful beings. But then again, I wouldn't need them either would I?

Once again, to wan't to be glorified I will have to feel desire. Another thing, for me to wan't to glorify myself I am commiting a sin (pride). And is not a good rolemodel for my humans.
If I wanted the humans to follow my rules, I would most importantly (more important then punish) follow my own example. What is the point in hell?
If god want people to be good to eachother, throwing them in hell for an eternity won't work.

If I would follow this mission without wanting to, I would not have free will. Or I would not be the most powerful force.

One good way to start I guess would be to stop throwing rocks at the humans.

[ April 07, 2002: Message edited by: Theli ]</p>

sighhswolf

Like I said in another thread, when you step outside of your home are you aware of the insect you just smashed into oblivion?
Are you aware that you may have just ended another living organisms existence?
And really do you actually care whether another insect bites the big one?
Wolf <img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" />

eh

Why not just look to a human being who has the same attributes of the Christian God instead? No one living seems to fit the bill, so I'm going to look into history for such a person. How does Josef Stalin sound?

I can just see uncle Stalin setting people's houses on fire, then proclaiming himself to be a saviour for ordering the blaze to be put out. I can also see him killing anyone who refused to thank him for this gift of love.

Imagine, if Stalin was omnipotent with all the super powers of Jehovah, his followers would practice a religion very much like Christianity. Wouldn't it be eery to have people on the streets tell you, "Stalin loves you, and doesn't want to set you on fire for eternity, so he killed his only son to save your soul"? Imagine a Stalinist version of Jack Chick!

MadMordigan

Now you must create a new intelligent species to enter a personal, meaningful, genuine, and most importantly of all - loving (in the purest sense of the word) relationship with you.

Why? Am I bored? Am I horny? Did my copy of The Sims crash my computer?

If I felt compelled to have company, I'd probably just replicate myself, but with tits.

Ideally these creatures will progress to becoming your trusted assistants in the afterlife.

What the hell would I need assistants for? I case I accidentally made a rock to heavy for me to lift?

[ April 07, 2002: Message edited by: MadMordigan ]</p>

Theli

I'm not sure how this relate to god, but to clearify it.
You have reason to step outside, you have a purpose to do so. Your purpose is not to step on insects (I hope). So if you were a loving god, what purpose would you bombing earth with asteroids have?
Or send plauges after your poor not understanding little humans, just to see them weep.

I like Chef's impression of god in South Park - Kenny Dies.
Chef: "The only reason god gives us life, and love is so he can take it all away from us."
Stan: "Then why does god give us any of those things to begin with?"
Chef: "Well... if you wan't to make a baby cry you give him a lollypop, and then you take it away from him. If you never had given him a lollypop to begin with he would have nothing to cry about.
So you see stan, it's our tears. It's our tears that gives god his great power."

TollHouse

Like someone above already noted, If I were God I'd be chillin with ma homies a lot more than the inviislbe God that billions of people on Earth worship.

That, and I'd personally smack around any Priest who tries to shove his dick up some kid. No free will bullshit for pedaphiles that violate the free will of alter boys.