spurly

Okay,

I've been here for a while now, and have read many, many, posts. I have a question for those here who are claim to be atheist.

If you were to believe in a God, what would that God have to be like? And do we even have the right to determine what characteristics an acceptable God would have?

Kevin

Daggah

What type of god would I believe in? Easy question. One whose existence is supported by evidence.

A better question is, what type of god would I believe in and *worship.* I would worship an all-benevolent, all-loving, omnipotent god.

Looking at the world around me, obviously, such a god does not exist. The condition of the world and the life on it does not support the existence of such a god.

Bumble Bee Tuna

I would believe in a God that showed evidence of existing.

I would "worship" a God if worshipping said God was more enjoyable than not doing so. I do not think an "omnibenevolent" God would require me to worship him, so probably not one of those. It would have to be a cruel, petty, OT-style God to need worship.

-B

MrDarwin

Like Daggah, the qualities of any deity are irrelevant to whether or not I would believe in it; to believe, I simply need evidence. Nor do we have any "right" to demand that a deity have this or that characteristic; if any deities really do exist, they exist quite independently of our wants and needs.

Unlike Daggah, I would not require such a deity to be omnipotent, all-loving, or even omnibenevolent, to worship it (although I would prefer the word "respect"). Just creating the universe and setting this wonderful world in motion, warts and all, would make me consider worshipping it (I come close to worshipping the universe itself). What I would not worship (at least I hope not, if push came to shove) would be a deity that intended to harm me, its creation, simply for being what it had created. Such a deity would be capricious and cruel. Nor would I have any wish to worship a deity that demanded that I worship it (or threatened me with punishment if I did not); such a deity would be vain and insecure.

Tell me Kevin, what kind of parent would you want to have, if you had a choice? What kind of parent would you respect? Would you respect a parent who demanded you love (not just obey, but really and truly love) him or her, and promised to physically hurt you if you didn't?

christ-on-a-stick

I would BELIEVE in a God who showed himself. To everyone. In the same way. No argument. Obvious, self-evident, consistent and empirically provable by facts and evidence.

As Daggah points out this would have nothing to do with whether or not to worship such God. That would depend on what the God was like. So with regard to this, That seems nonsensical to me. I think you are confusing the belief/worship issue with this (owing to your use of the term "acceptable")...

Let me put it this way... there are plenty of things out there that I don't LIKE - earthquakes, famine, disease etc. - but they EXIST so I believe in them. BELIEVING that they exist has nothing to do with whether i find them "acceptable" or not.

If I believed that God existed (based on my criteria above) why would I have any choice as to what he was like? That would only affect whether I thought he was worthy of worship or not.

However, I do believe that we have the right to determine what evidence there must be in order for belief in a God to be acceptable. We apply it to everything - otherwise we'd believe in all the supernatural notions, not just God, right? And that would make us gullible fools.

EDITED to add: Great post MrDarwin.

Starboy

Kevin, you might as well ask, 'What kind of tooth fairy would you believe in?' It assumes something for which there is no evidence and no reason to assume exists. A previous reason for invoking god/creators was ignorance. In this day and age we know and understand a great deal more. I will ask you this question: What evidence do you have to support your claim that there is a god/creator?

Starboy

Bumble Bee Tuna

The question is really a good insight into the minds of theists. They don't believe because they think God actually exists...No, they examine religions and choose one that "sounds nice". "Well, I really like the idea of salvation from Christianity, so I believe it". Right, and I really like the idea of someone handing me 50 million bucks tomorrow, but I'm not going to believe it's going to happen.

Believe based on whether it's true, people. Not on whether you like it or not.

-B

spurly

Well, there is proof from design. In order for something to be as complex as a universe, heck in order for something as complex as a single cell to exist, there had to be a designer. Things don't just happen to appear.

If there was a designer, then that designer has to be "god". Then the question becomes - which of the "gods" is the designer. Then you have to get into a study of theology.

The one who most fits the bill is Yahweh.

Kevin

Starboy

Kevin, I think we had this discussion on another thread. You did not respond to my last post. I'm not interested in running two threads with you on the same topic.

Starboy

christ-on-a-stick

Kevin! Glad I found you here You said and Since you failed to answer my direct question on a previous thread about who "designed" things like AIDS, ebola virus, multiple sclerosis, cancer, etc. - you only address why you think such things are allowed to exist - can I take it to mean that you believe God (Yahweh) designed the intricate details of these diseases? Meaning, not only did he allow what you call these "perversions of good" to exist, but sat down at the drawing board and designed all the details of how they would work, how we WOULDN'T be able to find cures for some of them, and decided on the exact degree of painfulness in the deaths they cause?

I would appreciate a direct answer on this.

Thank you