Freethought & Rationalism Archive

everettf · 06-22-2003, 05:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Calzaer
everettf: Ooh, oh, I see the problem. You think "theist" means "Christian".

the�ism (thē'ĭz'əm)
n.
Belief in the existence of a god or gods, especially belief in a personal God as creator and ruler of the world.

a�the�ist (ā'thē-ĭst)
n.
One who disbelieves the existence of God or gods.

everettf · 06-22-2003, 05:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Carbuncle
"He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation." - Colossians 1:15

"Now to the King eternal, immortal, invisible, the only God, be honor and glory forever and ever. Amen" - Timothy 1:17

You know, it's kinda hard to see something that is invisible. ^_^

but of course, that doesn't mean God doesn't exist! Gravity is invisible, but it exists. A black hole is invisible, but it exists. While not in the exact same settings as the previous examples, God does exist. We just can't see Him. And good thing, too. If we were to see Him in all His glory, well, we'd be pretty much roasted (for lack of a better word) by His holiness. I mean, can sinful eyes really behold righteous spirit without suffering? (Isaiah chapter 6)

Thank you for your time. May you have a nice day. ^_^

The differance is that all the things you mentioned can be scientificaly verified . your god or gods cannot.

I need to see it verified.\ by science.

emotional · 06-22-2003, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by everettf
The differance is that all the things you mentioned can be scientificaly verified . your god or gods cannot.

I need to see it verified.\ by science.

You never will. God is not a matter of scientific investigation. Scientific investigation can find out about the natural plane of God's creation. But as for the supernatural planes (the astral realms), and God Himself, Who is distinct from His creation, science cannot gain a toehold.

The existence of God is not discovered by science, nor discerned by reason, but is perceived by faith.

reddhedd · 06-22-2003, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
You never will. God is not a matter of scientific investigation. Scientific investigation can find out about the natural plane of God's creation. But as for the supernatural planes (the astral realms), and God Himself, Who is distinct from His creation, science cannot gain a toehold.

The existence of God is not discovered by science, nor discerned by reason, but is perceived by faith.

If you are correct, then we are all made in his image. Why then would he make himself utterly imperceptable to our senses, yet demand we recognize him?
If he will condemn me for not believing in him, will he also condemn me for not believing in the Invisible Pink Unicorn? (Praise be her mane!).
I have no proof that she exists, but in fact, she may actually be another face of god! Hey, maybe I'm on to something. If I can convince enough people that she does exist, then I can start a cult just like Jesus did.
BTW, 1 Tim 2:4 says you have to come to an accurate knowledge of truth. How can you do that without evidence to prove his reality?
K.

emotional · 06-22-2003, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by reddhedd
If you are correct, then we are all made in his image. Why then would he make himself utterly imperceptable to our senses, yet demand we recognize him?
If he will condemn me for not believing in him, will he also condemn me for not believing in the Invisible Pink Unicorn? (Praise be her mane!).

This is a falsehood that Christianity teaches. God does not condemn those who disbelieve in Him. God judges people only according to their acts of love and kindness done towards other, or omission thereof; not according to their beliefs. The atheist has as much a chance of going to the heavenly realms as the theist. Salvation is by works alone; faith counts for nothing.

Quote:

BTW, 1 Tim 2:4 says you have to come to an accurate knowledge of truth. How can you do that without evidence to prove his reality?

I hope you've realised I'm not a Christian...

ComestibleVenom · 06-22-2003, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
But as for the supernatural planes (the astral realms), and God Himself, Who is distinct from His creation, science cannot gain a toehold.

As for reality, it is God who cannot gain a toehold. I humbly move to join those with a firm grip on reality, even if it means I renounce the truth of those things with no connection to reality.

emotional · 06-22-2003, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ComestibleVenom
As for reality, it is God who cannot gain a toehold.

During the material life, in the material body, the existence of God is hidden, but after bodily death, the existence of God is made manifest. In other words: though you do not believe in God now, and I cannot prove Him to you, you WILL believe in Him when you die.

Carbuncle · 06-22-2003, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
During the material life, in the material body, the existence of God is hidden, but after bodily death, the existence of God is made manifest. In other words: though you do not believe in God now, and I cannot prove Him to you, you WILL believe in Him when you die.

Indeed. I believe that one day . . .

"... so that at the name of Jesus every knee will bow, of those who are in heaven and on the earth and under the earth, and that every tongue will confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father." - Philippians 2:10-11

I believe it's impossible to search for God in this life without believing that there is something beyond death.

^_^

reddhedd · 06-23-2003, 02:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
During the material life, in the material body, the existence of God is hidden, but after bodily death, the existence of God is made manifest. In other words: though you do not believe in God now, and I cannot prove Him to you, you WILL believe in Him when you die.

you have made the question of god's existence or non-existence entirely moot.
It doesn't matter either way, so why discuss it?
K.

Xixax · 06-23-2003, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
During the material life, in the material body, the existence of God is hidden, but after bodily death, the existence of God is made manifest. In other words: though you do not believe in God now, and I cannot prove Him to you, you WILL believe in Him when you die.

So then I'm saved once I die.

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