fishfood

This is the first time I've ever joined a group like this, so firstly, I would like to say "Hello!" I am fascinated by the struggle to find the historical Jesus; raised a Roman Catholic, I now pride myself, not in being an atheist, but in being a "FREE THINKER." I believe that everything in life should be questioned, and nothing, I mean NOTHING, should be accepted on the word of someone else, let alone complete and utter strangers. Having been spoon-fed my religion for the first 15 yrs of my life, it took me another 25 years to repair the 'damage' and find my own way of perceiving the world, and the "God" concept. I began reading all I could about Jesus - all the Seminar stuff, the "Jesus was a rural peasant" material...but nothing really grabbed me. Last week, I happened upon a just-published book, while searching aimlessly on Amazon. It's called Our Man in Judea: The Secret World of the First Gospel, by Janet Tyson. The author is a trained biblical scholar, but she has rejected academia and the entire Christian tradition, in order to analyze Jesus from a completely new perspective. The great thing is, she keeps the historical context of Jerusalem, Samaria, Pilate, etc., as opposed to putting Jesus somewhere up in Tibet...but comes up with a totally new understanding of who he was and what he was doing. She uses the Gospel According to John as her main text, which really surprised me, but it WORKS!
It turns out that Jesus was the Samaritan rebel mentioned in Josephus' history - the rebel who got Pilate sent back to Rome. He survived the crucifixion, and created a priestly dynasty at a place called Shiloh - which turns out to be the seat of the old, and anticipated, King of Israel!! The things she comes up with are so "neat" (the only word I can think of), so consistently linked to this central idea, that I felt I had finally "come home"! I found something that was believable! She doesn't present the information as FACT, but as possibilities, and encourages the reader to make other connections, to compare and contrast...I did...and her ideas are "stable." I would never have believed something NEW could be done in this field, but it has! I highly recommend the book, and would like to start up a discussion around some of her major themes. I checked out the website of the publisher - it's a small one - and it says there is a FREE e-version (though abridged, I think) to download...I tried, but it wasn't there...maybe you'll have more luck! It's worth it! Oh, the pub. site is <a href="http://www.trippinglightlybooks.com" target="_blank">http://www.trippinglightlybooks.com</a>
Hope to hear some other views! <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Toto

Hi Sparty, welcome to the Boards.

I could not download the .zip file. It may be that the time for the free offer has expired, but I emailed the contact info at the site.

The book is on Amazon:

<a href="http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0968991211/internetinfidelsA" target="_blank">Our Man in Judea</a>.

I'm not sure what you mean about "I would never have believed something NEW could be done in this field" - the hard facts about Christianity in the 1st century are so ambiguous that imaginative people come up with new theories on a regular basis, allowing the orthodox to scoff. Some of the theories are downright bizarre, many are possible. Have you read <a href="http://www.jesuspuzzle.com" target="_blank">The Jesus Puzzle</a>?

There is a discussion group on theories of the historical Jesus you might be interested in - <a href="http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JesusMysteries" target="_blank">http://groups.yahoo.com/group/JesusMysteries</a>

Oh, and would you happen to know the author of the book you are touting?

wildernesse

My view, fwiw, is that maybe your next post should sound less like advertising.

--tibac

GarColga

I read the reviews at Amazon, and it sounds like it will be a fascinating read. I won't be able to get to it for a while, but I was able to download the e-book after three attempts!

Toto

Agree, and it would be easier to read with a few paragraph breaks.

And I was able to download it the third time I tried. It is a zip file of an Adobe Acrobat text.

(edited to add - the site administrator actually replied to my email, said they had to do some changes but it was back up.)

[ August 17, 2002: Message edited by: Toto ]</p>

fishfood

Sorry if I sounded like I was "advertising"! I was simply very impressed, and I thought that's what this type of discussion board was all about -sharing ideas and insights...did I tread on someone's toes?!

Didn't realize there would be a problem with "long" paragraphs, either...guess that's me told! Are these short enough?!

Yes, the author is Janet Tyson.

And Yes, I have read some pretty wierd ideas, too, but I was looking for something that could help answer the down-to-earth, realistic questions for me. I can count on one hand the number of books that really make the grade, for me, anyway.

Maybe next time we can discuss some real hard evidence and ideas?

Kosh

Exactly what I thought while reading it. That first post reads like a late night infomercial. Looks like we've got a trend here.

Sparty, do you perhaps work in advertising?

Toto

Could you list the down-to-earth realistic questions you need answers for?

Also perhaps some of the books you have read, and why they did or did not make the grade?

I started reading the ebook, but I am on page 27 out of 309, and I probably won't finish it very soon. So far, it appears that the author is not a nutjob, but it is not so clear to me why she felt she had to leave the academic track (that may become apparent later on.)

not a theist

Meier has briefly dealt briefly with the issue of the Samaritans in his essay <a href="http://www.bsw.org/?l=71811&a=Comm05.html" target="_blank">The Historical Jesus and the Historical Samaritans: What can be Said?</a>

fishfood

No, I don't work in "advertising" - what is this hangup? I am a university tutor, actually...or is that a problem, too? I thought this would be an enlightening experience...so far only two of you have offered any interesting, or 'informed' comments...I thank you two! (oops, too long a paragraph for some, I fear?)

Some of the questions I really had trouble with were: Who were these two "angels" in the tomb? I was leaning toward the Essene theory, but found Tyson's argument much more 'realistic'.

I was also wondering about the possible relationship between Jesus and Mary, which is so popular a topic now - I just didn't know what to think.

I wanted to know why the Gospel of John seemed so different, why the figure of Lazarus seems so important, but is only mentioned, in a different context, in Luke.

I really wanted to understand WHY Jesus became so popular...or rather...so "famous" at all, given the number of religious 'rebels' at that time. I didn't want any more "Jesus was the Son of God" or "Jesus was a unique peasant who taught us all how to love" arguments.

I guess I just wanted to find a real man under all the "fluff" of Christianity.

I had read all the books by Brown, Pagels, Crossan, Smith, even Thiering (especially Jesus the Man
), but none convinced me. I don't know why, really...just seemed to be alot of the same old stuff. This new book really caught my imagination, that's all, and I wondered if anyone else had read it and felt similarly 'enlightened', at last!

One book that DID make the grade, that offered a really interesting alternative, was one that described Jesus in terms of Tutankhamun, i.e., they were one and the same! Sorry, I read this a long time ago, and can't remember the title, but it offered much historical information that suggested the entire story of Jesus was a retelling of Tut's story...for a new audience.
It had me wondering for years!

So, to all of you who are more concerned with "advertising" and with the length of my paragraphs, I politely thank you for your superficial interest, but suggest you open your minds just a little more. To those who offered other insights, and asked intelligent questions, I appreciate it.