Shpongle

Is such a thing possible?

BioBeing

This guy seems to suggest that, despite differences in chromosome number (24 in ape, 23 in humans), yes, it may be possible (althought the offspring may be sterile).

echidna

Sorry mods ...

http://deoxy.lycaeum.org/chimp/index.pl

nermal

I asked this question in The Freethought Exchange several years ago. Carl Sagan wrote in The Dragons of Eden that it would be possible, but research ethics had, to that point, precluded it.
As I recall, the editor of FTE, Tim Gorski, aka Timotheus, answered that a few cell divisions could be expected, but embryonic development would not occur. He was, as I recall, involved in genetics or some field of biology though my memory isn't sharp on that.

Ed

Dr.GH

Hey, 30 years ago this was a UC joke about cross hominid mating: Bigfoot proves that ********** girls will screw anyone that says "yes".

sakrilege

How long have chimps & humans been separated? Can this be compared with how long other hybrid parents have been separated?

pz

My personal opinion is that although there are no obvious genetic barriers that would absolutely preclude it happening, there are sufficient developmental differences that it is unlikely that such a hybrid could make it to term. The two areas most fragile and sensitive to developmental insult in humans, the brain and face, are also the two areas where we see some of the greatest differences between the two species.

I also don't buy the ethical argument against doing the experiment. I'd like to see it done -- it would be extremely interesting to see some of the differences emerge during development, and we could learn a lot about how our unique structures form. This would, however, be an experiment in embryology that requires in vitro fertilization, close observation, and a rather expensive animal host, which would be guaranteed to freak out both the animal and human experimental review boards, and would cost an awful lot of money to do. It also goes without saying that these would be embryos that should not be brought to term, if it turns out that such a thing is possible.

Another experiment that would get around the "every human sperm and ovum is sacred" crowd would be to test hybrids between other ape species. If Pan paniscus and Pan troglodytes, which diverged 2-3 million years ago, are not interfertile (does anyone know if this has been done, or has occurred naturally?), then it's pretty unlikely that Pan and Homo, which diverged 4-7 million years ago, can interbreed; on the other hand, if Pan and Gorilla can interbreed (which seems most improbable), then I'd be very surprised and would have to rethink my opinion of the human/chimp possibility.

The real argument against any of those experiments is expense, though. They're all rare and valuable species that are difficult to maintain in a lab, and our scientific efforts are better spent trying to conserve them rather than doing risky tinkering with their reproductive systems.

Godless Dave

You be the judge:

gcameron

Perhaps it's just an argument from emotion, or a religious background kicking in, but there's no way I could countenance such an experiment. Words like "abomination," "unholy" and "playing God" would flit around in my atheistic head (how's that for a contradiction!). I'm sure pz could deconstruct my objection and find it logically problematic. But it's one of those gut-feeling things.

My reaction, of course, would be downright benign compared to the outcry of the world at large.

Scientist: "We don't play God here."

Homer: "Are you kidding? All you do is play God! Just ask that parrot-octopus hybrid!"

Octoparrot: "***SQUAWK!*** Polly shouldn't be!"

pz

I'm afraid I have precisely no respect for the sanctity of embryos, and I wish we didn't have a culture that endows them with the reverence we ought to reserve for the living, breathing, thinking children to whom we give a substandard education, a lousy fat-rich diet subsidized by fast food corporations, or in the worst case, an environment filled with landmines, cluster bomblets, and heavy-metal vapor.

There is an unholy abomination lurking here, but it lies in the screwed up values that have been bestowed upon us by our long-deceased ignorant ancestors who viewed reproduction with such superstitious irrationality.