Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Mad Kally · 03-09-2003, 06:38 AM

Quote:

posted by frogsmoocher:
Well, there's "a bit blue" and then there's "depressed."

If someone is suffering from clinical depression, telling them to "cheer up" is the equivalent of telling a paraplegic to get up and walk.

Quote:

Originally posted by Sabine Grant
What qualifications do you have to diagnose any mental illness thru the Internet?

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure out what frogsmoocher said is correct. You have a computer, look it up sometime. You obviously haven't been there.

pz · 03-09-2003, 06:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sabine Grant
Clinical depression is a medical diagnosis.. I am amazed how your love for knowledge has placed you in the realm of being able to establish a diagnosis on line.Also I do suggest you read further than the first few words of a post before you decide to dwell on them while ignoring the context.

It seems to me that you are the one making the diagnosis here, that he is not suffering from any kind of real depression so that a simple "cheer up!" is enough. Others have just pointed out that the guy is wrestling with a real problem, have considered the possibility that he might be dealing with depression, and in general have avoided your superficial 'happy idiot' approach that trivializes the issue.

They aren't making a diagnosis. It's simply taking the matter seriously and considering a range of possibilities.

Kassiana · 03-09-2003, 06:52 AM

Hi, Eric. This is a reply to your first post here. I haven't read anything else in this thread yet.

I just wanted to say I hope you make the best decision for you. If you want a tool to help you out, I'd recommend the religion pages at religioustolerance.org

May you find what you're looking for!

Sabine Grant · 03-09-2003, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sabine Grant
Hi Eric and welcome to the forum!
First of... cheer up! Looking for meaning in your life is a normal and good thing to do. Most of us have gone thru that process. Meds do not always resolve depressive thoughts...especialy if triggered by a metaphysical quest.
Being a"true American" cannot be an advantage in those times when the country is dividing over the issues of war with Irak. Being one who promotes peace may be more of an advantage. ( being french I cannot help but entrust diplomacy rather than war).

Eternal life? I do not think it is the honest approach to embracing the christian faith. You either do it because you find validity and positive themes for yourself in the teachings of Christ or you sort of bargain your way thru pretending you love God under the condition He grants you heaven.

Being converted because someone convinced you that it is the best for you.... no. Christian faith, a genuine one, not impressed on you by anyone, comes as a long process of wanting and needing a relationship with God thru Christ. It starts with aknowledging your human condition and evaluating if you desire to depend on God to improve it. It is a very personal introspection. Once you evaluate if you need to depend on God or yourself, only then can you consider exploring christian faith.

It is important you not be focused on how christians act to determine if you want a relationship with God thru Christ. Focus on Christ not men. If you become a christian, you will need to expect the best only from Christ not from people. You will need to not have high expectations of people. You will need to work on yourself before you can pertain to inspire anyone else. It is a tough and challenging path to take.

Your quest will not be so much " how can I be happy" but mostly " how can I help?".

In any case, remember that you are valuable as a person. You are unique yet you feel and think as many others do. I suggest to you that you go on nature walks and delight in what nature offers to you as a free demonstration of the meaning of life. If you will deplore the flight of a falcon sweeping down on a sparrow, you will marvel at the designs on a butterfly's wings. Aknowledge the uniqueness of birds' songs and fragrances of various plants and flowers. Just watch the whole show. Pantheism played a role in my own spiritual walk.

Seek, explore, observe and allow whichever beauty out there to guide you.( the beach is a great place for that too).
A bientot, Veronique.

This is posted to all who want to pursue making an issue of the introduction I chose. You might as well take issue with the entire content... go for it or continue to call it a " happy idiot approach".

I absolutly believe that Eric is not alone in his present state of mind and needs to refocus on positive thoughts which confirm to him that he is a valuable individual. There is no need to promote a negative state of mind by making the individual feel even more isolated and abnormal.
As far as all those claims that some of you can diagnose clinical depression ( that is the term that was most recently used), only a physician can evaluate whether or not a person suffers of clinical depression and a specialist may I add. If Eric feels he needs to consult with a neurologist or seek some type of professional counseling, I certainly hope it would not be because he was led to believe he suffers of " clinical depression" by internet pals.
It is alarming the number of people in America who get medicated for conditions that may require other alternatives. ( that including ADD/ADHD children...).

In any case, I am absolutly shocked that individuals who pertain to promote rational thinking are actualy establishing a medical diagnosis on line!!!!!
Both posts expressing such " indignation" to my cheer up were assuming that Eric does suffer of depression and the latest even calls it " clinical depression".

ERIC : seek advice from the people who live by you and are close to you in terms of your mental health. Be careful with cyber evaluations of whom you are or may be.
KALLY : as a nurse I hope you refer to a physician's diagnosis before claiming your own. As far as what I know of various forms of depressions and mental illnesses, you have enough personal data that I shared with you in the past to avoid drawing the conclusions you drew.

Magus55 · 03-09-2003, 07:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lpetrich
Eric Starnes, if you desperately want to believe that you will get Pie in the Sky when you Die, I suggest that you consider converting to Islam. That religion features a Paradise that is IMO much more pleasant than the Xian Heaven of wearing a white robe and singing hymns all day -- you will get to live like a sultan and you will have your very own harem of Stepford-Wife houris.

Though even humping houris for eternity might get boring.

Edit: on second thought, I will have to concede that those houris are a rather sexist fantasy, but as fantasies go, I think I'd prefer them over singing hymns all day.

Um the Christian Heaven isn't just singing hymns all day. The full extent of Heaven isn't known .

We will live in mansions in a diamond/gold/gemmed city with crystal waters. Never tire, never get sick or age. Never have to eat or drink but we will be able to eat what we want. God may create more life and universes in which we will get to rule and watch over because we become above the angels in heaven. No pain, sorrow, tears, disease, hate, violence etc. We will be able to travel anywhere in the universe instantly and walk through walls like Jesus did. Can probably play sports, games etc. have picnics with friends and family beneath a crystal clear waterfall and rainbow and best of all be in God's presence for eternity. The possibilities are endless and God will have plenty of stuff for us to enjoy and keep us occupied.

Of course, if you prefer the Islam paradise idea of drinking tons of alcohol and having sex with whores and little boys all day long... erm whatever floats your boat?

Me, i'd take Heaven with Jesus over Islamic heaven any day. They don't compare unless you enjoy living in sin and find whoring out women acceptable.

Shadowy Man · 03-09-2003, 07:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Me, i'd take Heaven with Jesus over Islamic heaven any day. They don't compare unless you enjoy living in sin and find whoring out women acceptable.

Wait.. I thought Christians and Muslims believed in the same god. How are there separate heavens?

Magus55 · 03-09-2003, 07:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shadowy Man
Wait.. I thought Christians and Muslims believed in the same god. How are there separate heavens?

No they don't believe in the same God, Allah was originally a moon god. Allah and Yahweh are not the same.

Shadowy Man · 03-09-2003, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
No they don't believe in the same God, Allah was originally a moon god. Allah and Yahweh are not the same.

But when people defend keeping "Under God" in the Pledge of Allegiance they claim it doesn't offend Muslims or Jews because they all believe in the same god.

So that is untrue? The "God" referred to in the Pledge and on our money is the Christian god only?

Sabine Grant · 03-09-2003, 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pz
It seems to me that you are the one making the diagnosis here, that he is not suffering from any kind of real depression so that a simple "cheer up!" is enough. Others have just pointed out that the guy is wrestling with a real problem, have considered the possibility that he might be dealing with depression, and in general have avoided your superficial 'happy idiot' approach that trivializes the issue.

They aren't making a diagnosis. It's simply taking the matter seriously and considering a range of possibilities.

PZ... is most of my post missing from the thread that you qualify the entire content as a " simple cheer up" ( your words).?
A happy idiot ? the issue as I understand it is Eric in his Op asking guidances. Various people of various backgrounds have given him their opinion based on his comments in his OP. His request was not to ask " do you guys think I may suffer of clinical depression?"

Now that you personaly do not like what I explained to Eric because it reflects my personal faith and you have a very low tolerance level for individuals who express any form of religious faith.....
I expected to be challenged on what I presented to Eric as to the reality of christian faith.... certainly not on my determination to give Eric a feeling of normality in terms of his present state of mind.
I intend to move on from what you call the " issue".

hezekiah jones · 03-09-2003, 07:51 AM

Originally posted by Magus55
We will be able to ... walk through walls like Jesus did.

No, that was Gumby.

By the way, that's quite the appallingly materialistic fantasy you've got there.

03-09-2003, 06:52 AM	#53
Kassiana Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2000 Location: USA Posts: 5,046	Reply to Eric's first post Hi, Eric. This is a reply to your first post here. I haven't read anything else in this thread yet. I just wanted to say I hope you make the best decision for you. If you want a tool to help you out, I'd recommend the religion pages at religioustolerance.org May you find what you're looking for!

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03-09-2003, 07:51 AM	#60
hezekiah jones Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: WI Posts: 4,357	Originally posted by Magus55 We will be able to ... walk through walls like Jesus did. No, that was Gumby. By the way, that's quite the appallingly materialistic fantasy you've got there.

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