xian

not necessarily. those people were certain of God's identity. My criteria is I must be certain that what I am speaking to is God. No where did Abraham doubt the identity of the voice that was speaking to him. Furthermore, they did not have the Bible ...and the part in the Bible that specifically says how God will return....which is not to command some dude to kill someone.

they also did not have the part in the Bible where Jesus said "many will come saying I am He. do not trust them"

My doubts are fully justified...both Biblically and rationally.

Mageth

easily....God says "now look in your pocket" to which I pull out an envelope. Then God says "think of something".....then I open the envelope and my thouths are written there.

Isn't there a magician's trick very similar to that? It doesn't include carving things in mountains, though.

Mageth

It seems to me, xian, with what I perceive as your view of what god would and would not command you to do, that one could automatically conclude that a sensed command to kill someone would not be from god, no matter how fantastically conveyed. Why would you need to test it at all?

xian

i seriously think that if you could perform the following feat, it would qualify you to win the 1000000 James Randi prize:

Have James Randi stand 10 feet away from you, oppositte ends of a totally empty room that Randi has previously scientifically examined.

Have Randi empty all his pockets until he is satisfied they are empty.

You then tell randi, "Look in your pocket"

He pulls out an envelope. (this alone would qualify).

Then you say "Mr. Randi, think of anything in the universe....anything!"

Mr Randi thinks then says "Ok."

then you say "Open the envelope" to which he opens and on it his thoughts are written.


there is no magicians trick that does this. there can't be.

cpickett

Didn't I just see you post the other day that "God does not do tricks"? That seems to me to be about the same that as Baloo was asking for with his 32 digit number.

xian

i would test ANY command from some "being" that was not explicitly written in the Bible already. it seems like some of you people in here just think im some mindless orangutan that will willy nilly flippantly obey; any voice I hear over a loudspeaker saying "I AM GOD"

sorry, but you have the WRONG impression of me.

xian

man you people make me bang my head against the wall!!
:banghead:


OF COURSE I BELIEVE GOD DOES NOT DO TRICKS, THAT IS WHY I WOULD NOT BELIEVE SOME VOICE TELLING ME TO KILL SOMEONE WAS FROM GOD!!! DUH!


</END RANT>

Mageth

there is no magicians trick that does this. there can't be.

Well, you're asking god to do this very trick. It sounds like magic to me.

Further, I said similar trick, not the exact same trick (and you added to the trick in this post). The trick I remember is just about as impressive as the way you first described it, sure to work on the credulous.

xian

so? I'm not asking God to confirm himself in order for me to believe he exists, since He has already done that sufficient for me to have FAITH that He exists.

An explicit command requires identification that goes beyond faith.

why cant you atheists see the difference here? if you get a sticky on your desk telling you to do something HUGE saying it was from your boss, what mindless stupid moron would just do it without being certain it was from his boss?

I resent you atheists in here calling into question the FACT that I would not just blindly obey some voice claiming to be GOD without being CERTAIN that voice was from God.

then you have the audacity to equate my criteria of having faith that God exists and created the universe as being equal to believing some voice speaking to me was from GOD HIMSELF

man, i KNOW you people are smarter than this

Mageth

i would test ANY command from some "being" that was not explicitly written in the Bible already. it seems like some of you people in here just think im some mindless orangutan that will willy nilly flippantly obey; any voice I hear over a loudspeaker saying "I AM GOD"

sorry, but you have the WRONG impression of me.

I don't have that impression of you, and am not sure where you got the impression that I do. I figure that was conveyed pretty well in the post you're responding to here.

But the above seems to conflict a bit with your rant:

OF COURSE I BELIEVE GOD DOES NOT DO TRICKS, THAT IS WHY I WOULD NOT BELIEVE SOME VOICE TELLING ME TO KILL SOMEONE WAS FROM GOD!!! DUH!

Are you saying that you would not believe the voice that commanded you to kill, but would test it anyway, as you would test any command not explicitly written in the bible?

My question: Why would you even need to test it? With my understanding of the xian god/bible, I would say that one could automatically discard the perceived command to kill as false without bothering to test it.