Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Radorth · 04-06-2003, 03:28 PM

Quote:

The absence of Hell in the OT is a strong indication that it is a later invention.

Yeah "hell" only appears about twenty times in the OT. You apparently are commenting before having read the Psalms, Proverbs, Ezekiel, or Isaiah.

Perhaps the revelation of Christ widened the gulf and, also, there was no way for many OT luminaries to get out of some level of Sheol into paradise before Christ. It's called the New Covenant because there is one. IMO Christ's offer will means the former Sheol will be devoid of all but the incorrigible, and deserving of a new title. I believe "gnashing of teeth" signifies the recognition that God's best and final offer was knowingly rejected.

Rad

lpetrich · 04-06-2003, 03:41 PM

Radorth:
Yeah "hell" only appears about twenty times in the OT. You apparently are commenting before having read the Psalms, Proverbs, Ezekiel, or Isaiah.

That's Sheol, the realm of the dead, in which one has a shadowy existence -- if any at all (the Book of Ecclesiastes suggests that we have none at all).

I believe "gnashing of teeth" signifies the recognition that God's best and final offer was knowingly rejected.

The NT also describes hell as being burned alive and being eaten by worms.

orac · 04-06-2003, 04:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
The part we created after obtaining "the knowledge of good and evil" is sick and disgusting, and headed for self-extinction. And I'm sure there will be plenty of Christians around to witness it.

God created "the sins of the father shall be visted upon the sons."

Humans created "people should be punished for their own sins."

God created infinite torture as punishment for a single crime.

Humans created "punishment according to the crime" and "rehabilitation is better than revenge."

I see your point. Humans are obviously sick twisted and evil. We've come up with such sick and disgusting concepts. :banghead:

sakrilege · 04-06-2003, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
The part we created after obtaining "the knowledge of good and evil" is sick and disgusting, and headed for self-extinction.

Gee, there were 2 people when it was perfect. Now there are over 6 billion after obtaining the knowledge of good and evil. Self-extinction?

Radorth · 04-06-2003, 04:40 PM

Quote:

That's Sheol, the realm of the dead, in which one has a shadowy existence --

So what? It is not exactly a happy place, esp in the "lower parts." David certainly uses it to describe a hellish existence. "NT invention" is wishful thinking.

Rad

Radorth · 04-06-2003, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Now there are over 6 billion after obtaining the knowledge of good and evil. Self-extinction?

The remarkable irony is that if we weren't so prone to kill each other, and let each other starve to death, we would have long ago reached the limits of earth to support us. Does that suggest anything to you about the wisdom of Christ and the prophets, our sorry condition, or what our lone hope might be?

Rad

winstonjen · 04-06-2003, 05:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
The remarkable irony is that if we weren't so prone to kill each other, and let each other starve to death, we would have long ago reached the limits of earth to support us. Does that suggest anything to you about the wisdom of Christ and the prophets, our sorry condition, or what our lone hope might be?

Rad

So, instead of fixing up problems here on earth, we should work towards making things better for the afterlife? How will that help us? And what is so unique about it?

Yellum Notnef · 04-06-2003, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by orac
We've come up with such sick and disgusting concepts. :banghead:

And this misunderstood mythology known as 'Christianity' has to be one of the most disgusting.

Magus55 · 04-06-2003, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Fenton Mulley
And this misunderstood mythology known as 'Christianity' has to be one of the most disgusting.

Atheism isn't any better.

winstonjen · 04-06-2003, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
Atheism isn't any better.

How so? Are you saying that eternal nothingness is as bad as eternal pain?

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04-06-2003, 03:41 PM	#72
lpetrich Contributor Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Lebanon, OR, USA Posts: 16,829	Radorth: Yeah "hell" only appears about twenty times in the OT. You apparently are commenting before having read the Psalms, Proverbs, Ezekiel, or Isaiah. That's Sheol, the realm of the dead, in which one has a shadowy existence -- if any at all (the Book of Ecclesiastes suggests that we have none at all). I believe "gnashing of teeth" signifies the recognition that God's best and final offer was knowingly rejected. The NT also describes hell as being burned alive and being eaten by worms.

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