jfryejr

If God spans all time, as in he is the alpha and omega, not he was the alpha and will be the omega, wouldn't that mean that to him, I am already dead and in heaven or hell.

Also, if God is outside of time, wouldn't heaven be as well. So, I could feasibly (in the Catholic tradition) ask myself, as a Saint (haha), for special favors.

If it's true that he does span all time and the "judgement" has already happened, could my soul, while residing in my body now, simultaneously reside in heaven or hell.

Comments?

This question assumes some timeless god exists (like Yaweh, Allah) and that this god judges and has a heaven and/or hell (like Allah, Yaweh).* I'm not looking for an existence/non-existence argument--they give me headaches.

*This does not necessarily represent the view of the poster...

Santas little helper

Fascinating thoughts jfryejr.I've made similar thoughts myself.
I assume by dead you mean your physical body.I would say yes, God can perceive any event at
any point in time and space so he can perceive your death as well as your birth and the
birth and death of your children ( if you have any ) and your grandchildren and so forth.
I would say that it does.
Of course this presents a bit of a problem.If you are in heaven or in hell ( and the same goes for me )
why aren't we experiencing heaven or hell ? ( I'm not ; not sure about you )

Anyone has thoughts on that ?

jfryejr

I think that is what I was trying to ask, but couldn't quite phrase it...

I guess one could argue, depending on religious beliefs, that people aren't in heaven until the end of time...I don't know what the xtian Bible (never quite "got" Revelation) and the Koran write about this.

But, that argument could bring about another problem...if god is spanning all of time simultaneously, how could it ever end. Time should constantly progress from beginning to end ad infinitum. Hmmm...:banghead:

Thanks for the reply!

Philosoft

As this topic seems to specify the Judeo-Christian God, I think it fits better in GRD.

Magus55

I think you are a bit confused Jfr. Yes God exists outside time. Meaning he isn't bound to it. And God can see the past, present, and future all at once, as though its the present. But you are still bound in time, therefore the timelessness doesn't apply to you ( meaning you aren't judged yet, and aren't in Heaven/Hell).

And for God, time never does end. Time doesn't exist to God in the sense that it does to us. 1 day to God is as 1000 years to us - its meaningless. God has existed for all eternity up to this point. Before Time was created, He was. He controls Time, not the other way around.

mark9950

God must have seen the 9-11 twin towers attack,but due to his incompetence did nothing about it.

I wander how many parents will let their child drink anti freeze and let them die without going to the hospital?

Doctor X

Indeed, Magnus, as mark demonstrates, your line of reasoning:

leads to four out of the Five Choices [All Rights Reserved.--Ed.]--all of the ones other than Non-Existence.

You have certainly removed any excuse for him not to intervene in unjustified suffering. If he wants it to happen, he becomes Evil. If he cannot--sort of like The Watchmen's "Dr. Manhattan"--because everything that did and will happen is happening at the same time to him so he cannot actually intervene--he becomes Irrelevant. If he has no idea how to intervene he becomes Incompetent. Of course, he can still be a Combination of those three.

--J.D.

Philosoft

I'm guessing apologetics becomes much easier when you abandon rationality and cohesiveness when formulating your explanations. Does the above make sense to you, Magus? Really?

mark9950

I used the wrong analogy

How many parents if they see their child run in front of a car,just let him do it and get hit?

Without the parents doing whatever they can to run to him and get him out of the way even if the parent is in fear of getting hit.

Diadectes

Magus, as has been pointed out to you on several occasions, there is a difference between time never ending and time not existing. You need to decide which you mean if your apologetics are to make any sense. At present they are meaningless twaddle. An eternal (timeless) being cannot act in time. It may be able to see past, present and future as one, but would be able do nothing about it because there is no point in time at which it could intervene, because time for this being does not exist.

An everlasting one (for whom time doesn't end) could, because it would be temporal, and might therefore be able to influence events, but it wouldn't be able to see past present and future all at the same time. If you believe in an interventionist God, then I would argue that you are talking about an everlasting being that exists in time and therefore in our universe. But I'm not sure this would be the standard Christian God. Maybe the tribal entity that the Christians comandeered for their own mysterious purposes, but not the eternal 'ground of all being', or anything like that.