Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Cipher Girl · 05-08-2003, 09:21 PM

i would consider myself a far right Christian, someone who holds to a conservative point of view in a political sense and also has accepted Christ as Lord and Saviour. outside of that i think any further description would require the appropriate adjectives.

Why do you say "far right"? I see nothing extreme in such a position. I would call you a conservative christian, not a far right christian. Unless of course, you are insecure and would like to force every one to think exactly like yourself.

fatherphil · 05-08-2003, 10:21 PM

oh, is that what "far right" means? does "far left" carry the same connotation?

Daggah · 05-09-2003, 07:29 AM

Quote:

Maybe I need to give you some facts to help you consider that many christians have ( since the topic involves now comparaison with Hitler's ideology) indeed reacted against the Shoah.
Many during the German occupation sheltered Jews, transported them to Italy or Switzerland, obtained fake IDs for them, fought to the sacrifice of their own lives against the entire nazi system.

Meanwhile, Martin Luther's own writings were revered by the Nazis at meetings and the like, and his words on what to do with the Jews are scary foreshadowing for the nightmare to come...

Radorth · 05-09-2003, 07:58 AM

Quote:

I guess this is what happens when he has been told his entire life that he is a "worthless sinner". It's very sad.

One hardly needs legalistic Christian parents make one feel worthless and treat others as worthless. We have plenty of examples of atheist parents around the world doing a fine job themselves. Who could wish to be one of the offspring of leftist Chinese Communists, or even of Madeline Murray O'Hare? (Whose son became a Christian)

A far better approach to child raising is to teach them that only sin is worthless, while they themselves are of infinite intrinsic worth. Any other approach borders on the irresponsible and teaches them irresponsibility. As soon as you judge a child strictly by their actions, you have pretty well doomed them.

I'm afraid anyone who can't see Jesus' compassion for the lost, oppressed, weak and broken is no Christian anyway. As far as I'm concerned, skeptics can be pretty hard-assed and judgemental about weaknesses in others, so I don't buy this stuff.

Rad

Radorth · 05-09-2003, 08:16 AM

Quote:

Sabine, you just made my point. You, a christian, simply don't want to talk about the subject, and don't want others to discuss it either.

Bullocks. I have yet to see Sabine shy away from any discussion, unless she sees it sliding into personal attacks . (Me, I hang in there unable to resist holding up mirrors. Heh). In any case, she failed to make the "loving Christians" list, I believe because she does not shy away from so many arguments.

Rad

beth · 05-09-2003, 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth
One hardly needs legalistic Christian parents make one feel worthless and treat others as worthless. We have plenty of examples of atheist parents around the world doing a fine job themselves. Who could wish to be one of the offspring of leftist Chinese Communists, or even of Madeline Murray O'Hare? (Whose son became a Christian)

A far better approach to child raising is to teach them that only sin is worthless, while they themselves are of infinite intrinsic worth. Any other approach borders on the irresponsible and teaches them irresponsibility. As soon as you judge a child strictly by their actions, you have pretty well doomed them.

I'm afraid anyone who can't see Jesus' compassion for the lost, oppressed, weak and broken is no Christian anyway. As far as I'm concerned, skeptics can be pretty hard-assed and judgemental about weaknesses in others, so I don't buy this stuff.

Rad

I tend to agree with this. I see nothing wrong with this approach to parenthood.

Tarnaak · 05-09-2003, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mageth
But I do look to the Bible as my primary source of inspiration and base my answers to any question relating to "Religion" based on the Bible and the study thereof....

This is one reason I am participating in these Discussion Forums. These actually help me to better understand my faith than "just" doing a "bible study".

Well, that's a commendable reason for a theist to be here.

To better understand your faith, and religion in general, you might also want to consider reading/studying other religious texts (e.g. the great Buddhist writings) and books on religion, both specific religions and religion in general. You need to get outside your holy book to gain a better understanding of it.

PRFACE: The following just came to be and though it may apply, was not intended to be directed to Mageth, with exception to the first four paragraphs.

My understanding of other religions is lacking I admit. I would say however that the reason I have not done much study of other religions is that "from what I've heard" none compare to the totality of what the Bible teaches, both in History and in Morality. Other religious writings are comparable, in that they teach us morality, but outside of Martyrdom, none can claim what the Christian Bible does.

Specifically, that a religion had a person that claimed to be God incarnate, did miracles with witnesses, then specifically died as payment for our sins then rose from the dead as proof of Godhood.

I realize that no religion out there can "prove" God exsists, or even prove that their religion is the "true" religion. But based on circumstantial evidences (quite a lot I might add), I prefer to believe in a God, the Christian God (Trinity) in hopes that an afterlife of immortality is real.

I have actually tried to not be believe in a God, but "something" always pulls me back. I found that the harder I tried to NOT believe, the more God became real.

(End of answer to Mageth directly)

For further consideration:

"If I chose to not believe in God, and God exsists, then I have chosen unwisely. If I chose to believe in God, and God doesn't exsist, then I HAVE chosen wisely."

If one does not seek the truth earnestly, then one is just doesn't care about themselves IMHO. If one was to EARNESTLY seek and not find, then they can at least say "I sought but did not find". You will have a defence with the Lord God should you find yourself there. For the Scriptures say, "Seek and ye will find".

But perhaps thats the problem. One may not WANT to find the truth because one is satisfied with their belief and just doesn't care. Or perhaps one is afraid to find the truth, that it would "mess up" their lifestyle.

I can only speak for myself (for I do not know others thoughts and actions who profess Christianity) but I write of these things out of "love" for the brothers and sisters of Humanity. I am not trying to "convert" anyone, but if I am able to start a process of thought that leads one to God, then I have done my task as assigned by the Lord Almighty. The "seed" has been planted, I leave the rest to the Holy Spirit as he sees fit.

In peace,

James

Sabine Grant · 05-09-2003, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cipher Girl
My pet peeve is the unwillingness of an entire nation to sacrifice some degree of free speech to protect racial minorities from dangerous and criminal ideology.

Sabine, you just made my point. You, a christian, simply don't want to talk about the subject, and don't want others to discuss it either. I think getting discussion about racism and bigotry out in the open and lampooning such crazy groups is probably the best way to combat them. Its hard to take someone seriously when everyone is laughing at them.

Frankly I am confused how you can make such an assumption on my account considering you do not know me personaly nor do you have any knowledge of the 47 years of my life and whether or not I am an individual who " does not want to talk about the subject and does not want others to talk about it" You then proceed into a harangue where you are actualy " preaching to the choir".

Rather than giving you a detailed brief on how much exposure I had to bigotry and racial oppression in the various cultures I lived in, I will ask you to stop making assumptions. If you wish to pursue your " you, a christian" type of characterization of another individual, it will be clear to me that your original opening post contained another agenda than how it was presented.

May I ask you what type of anti racist and pro human rights activism you are involved in ? surely with the passion you seem to exhibit, have you joined groups who fight against white supremacist and extremist ideologies as well as support human rights throughout the world.

BioBeing · 05-09-2003, 02:12 PM

Tarnaak - I wanted to make some comments on your previous post, but felt this was not the right place, since this thread has already kinda gotten sidetracked. So I've zoomed off to your own Why Atheism thread (seemed appropriate for you to discuss your beliefs in your own thread!) Hope this is OK with everyone?

BioBeing · 05-09-2003, 05:58 PM

Oooops - messed up somehow. try this link http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...972#post980972 instead.

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05-08-2003, 09:21 PM	#41
Cipher Girl Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Sunny Southern California Posts: 657	i would consider myself a far right Christian, someone who holds to a conservative point of view in a political sense and also has accepted Christ as Lord and Saviour. outside of that i think any further description would require the appropriate adjectives. Why do you say "far right"? I see nothing extreme in such a position. I would call you a conservative christian, not a far right christian. Unless of course, you are insecure and would like to force every one to think exactly like yourself.

05-08-2003, 10:21 PM	#42
fatherphil Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: burbank Posts: 758	oh, is that what "far right" means? does "far left" carry the same connotation?

05-09-2003, 02:12 PM	#49
BioBeing Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 6,004	Tarnaak - I wanted to make some comments on your previous post, but felt this was not the right place, since this thread has already kinda gotten sidetracked. So I've zoomed off to your own Why Atheism thread (seemed appropriate for you to discuss your beliefs in your own thread!) Hope this is OK with everyone?

05-09-2003, 05:58 PM	#50
BioBeing Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 6,004	Oooops - messed up somehow. try this link http://www.iidb.org/vbb/showthread.p...972#post980972 instead.

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