Plump-DJ

Frankly i think the whole idea of "I'm a Free Thinker" is just a sort of "emotional being part of a group thing" where people can label themselves Freethinkers. Regardless of how freely i try to think about things i don't think i can ever be sure, atheist or theist that i am free of the subjective or "the aesthetic". Hence i'd never proclaim myself to anyone as a "Freethinker". So i don't even see the merit of employing the label (at least upon myself) in the first place.

-=-=-=-

"I mean like Yeah man, i'm like a Free thinker and stuff."

[ September 27, 2002: Message edited by: Plump-DJ ]</p>

HelenM

If this is a requirement of being a freethinker then I'd say there are none!

I mean, come on, get real - we're all emotionally attached to our beliefs!

Helen

HelenM

Not to you perhaps. But to some people, my being a theist is more enough reason . Which is interesting because it shows that their brain seems to be controlled by a continually running program whose instructions are

IF theist is encountered
THEN rant about Christianity, projecting all your anger onto them.


I don't call that 'freethought' myself. But, what do I know?

And I do agree that it's wise to use language in the same way as other people do. But I don't think you were disagreeing with that. I think you were saying, don't concede to someone else's labelling of you unless it really fits.

take care
Helen

Panta Pei

Well, you have just described all the theists that I know...including HelenM.

They truly see the evidence for God, having examined all the other options with their freedom to think and will not submit to your assertion of authority as a non-theist.

They may also have their faith, their group membership and their emotional attachments, however, this is a universal quality found on this site in abundance and is irrelevant to one's ability to think freely and examine evidence.

Conclusions based upon evidence are still open to interpretation and that is what freethought is all about.

Strong convictions regarding metaphysical naturalism, for instance, should not limit one from exploring other possibilities...unless one is not a freethinker, of course.

Starboy

You know, I think it is very funny that this one simple question should trigger such an avalanche of indignation. Could it be I have struck a nerve? If Christians start calling themselves freethinkers then next will they start calling themselves a-theist? Is this another example of “if you can’t beat them join them”?

Starboy

Pseudonymph

Why do you think they are trying to "beat" you? You seem happy and almost elated in a bizarre way to imagine that you have aroused such "controversy"(when in reality I see little if any signs of indignation)

Why is what we call ourselves so important? Is it just to help give us an identity?

HelenM

If only I was a freethinker so I could apply all my brain to this question, that no doubt reflects the exalted pinnacles that freethought can take a person to...

Hmmmm...lemme see...there has to be a Bible verse about this...oh no, I can't find one, time to PANIC!!!!!!!!!!!

galiel

Since I have the greatest respect and affection for HelenM, I looked in vain for the point where people started to "jump" on here. StarBoy asked a legitimate question. If one holds the Bible as the authority (note he didn't say "one of your authorities", he said "The" authority), then one does not match the definition of "freethinker".
Since he previously posted a dictionary definition of the term, it is clear what his meaning was.

Helen's response was to support an article that seeks arbitrarily to redefine the term to the point it has no meaning.

I then responded, idenitifying (some of) the logical falacies in that article. I then commented--with a smile, I might add--"Helen, you didn't answer the question."

Where, precisely, did anyone jump on her?

And why, precisely, is the question stil unanswered?

HelenM

It's odd isn't it, that a non-freethinker could make a choice like not answering a question...

I don't think it's resolvable, myself

But I do respect you too!

take care
Helen

Plump-DJ

Starboy wrote..

Why can't Christian's who've come to their position after some thought call themselves freethinkers? How are they any different to anyone else who comes to any other meta-position?

Of coures i think this highlights (in my view at least) why the term free thinker as a label isn't very useful. The name itself is almost like a piece of rhetoric that atheists or skeptics or "traditional free thinkers" can use to bash Christians etc over the head with.