waj

I don't know why I'm even bothering, but...

Except that the economic fruits of these events are supposed to take place "by the end of this millennium."

Recent predictions by Kim Clement, all of which didn't come true, from the web site you pointed to:

It is particularly interesting that the God Kim Clement claims to speak for seems to be as ignorant about the Arabic world as Kim Clement is: Saddam Hussein, who's too secular for the taste of many in the region, is cast as the leader of Islam.

This would be entertaining if it wasn't so frightening that people believe this stuff and use it to reinforce their own nationalism and bigotry.

TrueThinker

Well to me it is not jibberish, but to you it may be.

This one is clearly not jibberish, and it is from March 2001, long before 9/11. Click on it if you can, or copy the address if the link does not work Audio

Neither is this

"Imagine a Picture of Terminal Illness. The Days of Saddam Are Over"

"This is the King of Babylon, and By the Vomit You Will Be Imprisoned"

"Hussein is Guilty"

"You Will Crush the Guilty Saddam and the Month of Eyar Will be Restful"

"And Manasseh is Casting a Cloud on Him, and We Will Pick Up the Dead Bin Laden"

"Hussein is a Vapor. Like a Guarded Lamb, God is Keeping Jews and Levites Whole. And the Cell Inside Your Dwelling will become a Torture Chamber"

"And When Hussein will Recognize the Checkmate, there will be Wine in Them"

"Please Value the Day of Might. Who? Iraq. The Song Will Awaken Him"

"Yesterday Evening They Whispered, Bin Laden is Dead"

"He Will Wonder Where the Hiding Bin Laden is Sleeping (Lodging)"


Shall I confuse you even more? Naah...

waj

Eeewwww... but not a very difficult prison to break out of!

TrueThinker

Clement doesn't believe Hussein is the leader of Islam. nobody uses prophecy to enforce their nationalism and bigotry. You're welcome to believe that, but that is not the reality.

Do you fail to realize that Babylon is where Hussein is, and is a key spot even in biblical times?

Yes, I don't even kow why you are bothering.

worldling

TrueThinker wrote:

In response to my suggestion that the phrase "they did something to our people as they flew over Long Island" is a rather poor description of the terrible events of 9/11, TrueThinker replies:

and goes on to say that, actually, it wasn't that specific reference that lead him to "know" the prophecy was about 9/11, but a whole load of other stuff that was spoken over a period of four days, but he won't post it all because he doesn't want to "confuse" us. As if anything that came after could magically make "what they did to our people as they flew over Long Island" an adequate description of 9/11. As Bumble Bee Tuna pointed out, none of the flights passed over Long Island on that day:
<a href="http://a188.g.akamaitech.net/f/188/920/15m/www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/nation/graphics/hijack091101.htm" target="_blank">9/11 flight paths</a>
(Edited to add: And even if they did, the description still wouldn't cut it - the significant event involved the impact of two planes on two skyscrapers in lower Manhattan.)

In response to my comparing his mindset to that of a suicide hijacker, TrueThinker says:

I believe I know you well enough, TrueThinker. Try this little experiment:

This person believes in a universal creator who takes a personal interest in his life, thoughts and actions. This person also believes that this deity has set out guidelines for human behavior in the form of a Holy Book, which must be interpreted correctly. This person believes he and his co-religionists have interpreted the Holy Book correctly, and that he is thus privvy to the will of the deity. Anyone with a different Holy Book, or radically different interpretation of the same Holy Book is simply wrong. This person knows he is right. This person strives to live by what he imagines to be the will of the deity, because this person wants, above all else, to please it. This person's thoughts, words, and actions are all influenced by the certainty of his beliefs, and centre around the the hope that he will be rewarded with eternal paradise after death.

Who am I talking about? TrueThinker, or a suicide hijacker? It could be either or both. The deluded egocentricity of the mindset is exactly the same. If this fact makes TrueThinker uncomfortable, then that's his problem. But he can't just brush it off as an "insult".

[ November 27, 2002: Message edited by: worldling ]</p>

TrueThinker

waj,

No. This is the beginning of the seven years of prosperity. If you're going by "the end of this millenium" then he also began the prophecy by saying "there has been a terrorist act", but the "act" he was describing had not happened yet. This can be a problem when communicating with the Eternal God, who sees the future as now. When God says He will take the economy and raise it up by this "time", we may not actually see the fruit until later. Am I making sense? Example, the Spirit of the Lord says America should not lose hope because He has defeated her enemies (Hussein, Bin Laden) but they're both alive right now. He said the same to King Ahaz, and that the sign of victory would be that of Immanuel- which did not happen until several years after Ahaz's death. He spoke of Cyrus to Isaiah as if he were alive then, but Cyrus did not appear until several years after Isaiah.

Well he did not say oil will be found within the month. But he did say America would find oil. "Within the month", Oct-Nov, the economy and our finances would begin to change. The stock market has reported gains for the last 3-4 weeks last time I checked. When was the last time the DOW moved past 8900 points? I'm an optimist and i see that as the economy definitely changing for the better. You, on the other hand, may be a pessimist and may not see this as an improvement. He also prophesied this within those days in 2001:

America’s hearts are ready for the voice of God as never before and now you will see a drop in the Psychic Prophets. You will see a drop in the Psychic Financial Prophets because their voice in one moment has no power whatsoever. Now God is raising up his prophets

That will speak to the Nation
And will speak to the President
And will speak to the Senate
And will speak to the people of God
And there shall His voice be heard!

Reminds me of the VH1 show Where are they Now?. So where did they go? When did we last see a psychic commercial on television? Whatever happened to Miss Cleo? The Psychic Friends Network?

How do you determine this is a false prophecy?

Did he give a deadline? No.

How is this a false prophecy? 1 year is not equal to 7 years, or is it? Have seven years passed?

[ November 30, 2002: Message edited by: TrueThinker ]</p>

Radcliffe Emerson

Not only is is nothing of the kind, the versions that say 'virgin' are not translated correctly, from my studies. It should say 'young woman'.

Butters

originally posted by Radcliffe,

No argument from me, it is clear that it says "young woman", not "virgin". It is also clear that Isaiah, "went unto" the young woman and then she concieved a child, no miracle there.

David Conklin

The Hebrew word used here by Isaiah is the word "'almah". It refers to a "young woman of marriageable age who is sexually mature who is not already married." In that day and age such a woman had better be a virgin, so that is its connotation. Later, when the LXX was made they used the word "parthenos" which also means virgin. For details on this see my study at <a href="http://members.tcq.net/dconklin/Isa714/open.html" target="_blank">http://members.tcq.net/dconklin/Isa714/open.html</a> -- as you can tell by the 95 sources I used in my bibliography I used sources from all sides of the issue and professionals in the field vs. the mere claims of most critics.

[ November 30, 2002: Message edited by: David Conklin ]</p>

WWSD

I'll gladly take you up on this offer TT.
But...
This game has too many loopholes for you to slip out of when what you pray for doesn't materialize.
What will your rationalization be when what you pray for fails to happen?
God's will? Timeframe problems? My heart isn't open?

Anycase:
I'd like to see a positive resolution of my parents financial situation within the next year. All debts paid for in full, one large money sink sold off, some sort of short term investment plan materializing, no more IRS. That's all.

Or you could pray that it snows in my homestate on Xmas eve. And I mean large puffy snowflakes, the kind that drift lazily along and look realy pretty.
And I'd like three to six inches please, since we're in the middle of a drought and I really don't want to see my home state burning down again next summer.
So there you have it, I want you to end this drought.

Alternatively, you could pray that Portishead comes to my town next year and that I meet Ms. Perfect.
But god doens't do selfish requests does he?

In any case, I have serious doubts that your prayer will do anything more than prove to be wasted effort on your part.

And if these things do, indeed, come to pass? Well, I'll ask Jesus to come into my heart, get baptized at the church of your chouce, and I'll get out my bible and start trying to educate these poor heathens. I'll do it as seriously as I can, given that my heart has probably been "hardened" over the years.

I won't even ask you to do a thing when these prayers fail.
But I will reserve gloating rights.
How's that?

You're not going to tell me somehting along the lines of "god doesn't work that way" are you?