Freethought & Rationalism Archive

notMichaelJackson · 08-09-2003, 02:08 PM

If the world is only six thousand years old, then not only were our high school biology books wrong, but history books, as well. Do YECs write history books to suit their biases?

A quick Yahoo search gives us this page, which claims some pyramids were constructed around 2500 BC. YECs claim that the Flood occured at that time.

emotional · 08-09-2003, 02:58 PM

One of the questions that bothered me when I was an Orthodox Jewish young-earth creationist was the origin of the races. The Bible accounts only for Middle-Easterners (Shem), North Africans (Ham) and Europeans (Japheth). The rest of humanity, such as the Chinese, and not to mention the natives of America and Australia, are unaccounted for.

My rabbis were at a loss to answer those questions of mine. In the end I had to accept that the Bible could not write but about the world known to its writers. Which means a human-sized, not a God-sized, authorship. There went Bible inerrancy, and my departure from Orthodox Judaism wasn't far off.

AJ the greek · 08-10-2003, 02:59 AM

try www.bjup.com Bob Jones Press
or www.abeka.com Pensacola Christian College

Both are big players in the homeschool world, you can rest assured that their biases are suited.

judge · 08-10-2003, 03:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by notMichaelJackson
If the world is only six thousand years old, then not only were our high school biology books wrong, but history books, as well. Do YECs write history books to suit their biases?

A quick Yahoo search gives us this page, which claims some pyramids were constructed around 2500 BC. YECs claim that the Flood occured at that time.

The first chapters of genesis are one portion of the bible that we know underwent corruption long ago.
If we use the timeline found in the LXX (ancient greek version of the bible) it is possible to arrive at a flood date in the mi 4th century B.C.

here is one article placing the flood at 3537 B.C.

http://www.ldolphin.org/barrychron.html

Roland · 08-10-2003, 08:15 AM

Interesting.

According to the Bible, all languages derive from the Tower of Babel incident around 2200 B.C.

Yet, we have at least two languages (The Egyptian and the Sumerian) existing at least 1000 years before that time.

emotional · 08-10-2003, 08:44 AM

Oh, don't get me started about the Tower of Babel! That's one of the prominent areas where the folk-tale of Genesis just melts down in the face of the true, evolutionary account.

Languages evolve and speciate before our very historical eyes. Speciation is when two speakers are no longer mutually intelligible. Italian, Romanian and Portuguese are three descendants of Latin that underwent speciation and are now no longer mutually intelligible. And all by natural means - just through mutating along the generations. Not to mention the various Indo-European branches, like English and Russian, which are much more remote than the Latin derivatives. Except for a few core-words (family nouns and numerals), English and Russian have speciated to the point that they seem as unrelated as Chinese and Mayan. If speech-mutation through time can do this to previously related languages, why assume that a divine act of speech confusion was needed to make the first mutually unintelligible language species?

Biblical literalism, in its YEC kind, demands not only the reformation of biology, astronomy and even history, but also a radical reformation of linguistics. I wonder how many linguists take Scientific Babelism seriously. There is no dispute whatsoever in the linguistic community that languages are the product of [Lamarckian] evolution.

Unlike biology, where I am still a beginner, linguistics is an area of science I really know well about, having studied it from early childhood.

08-10-2003, 11:24 AM

Quote:

emotional:
I wonder how many linguists take Scientific Babelism seriously.

"Scientific Babelism" -- I love it! :notworthy

emotional · 08-11-2003, 07:48 AM

Scientific Babelism is from here.

08-11-2003, 08:16 AM

Thanks for the link. It's a beautiful article.

Jimmy Higgins · 08-11-2003, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by emotional
Oh, don't get me started about the Tower of Babel! That's one of the prominent areas where the folk-tale of Genesis just melts down in the face of the true, evolutionary account.

It gets worse. The story itself is absurd. God fearing that man can actually reach heaven using a tower? How archaic and childish of an idea. Its absurd. And worse yet, this apparently loving god repeats an act of holding man back, such as seen in Paradise, by confusing everyone. Can you feel the love? Its the second time that man has attempted to sit beside god, and it was the second time god thwarted man.

The tower in of itself is interesting. The Palestinians marvel at its construction in the story. They mention that it is created of bitumen and mortar! Such materials were used in "Israel" for common buildings, not important ones. But Paletinians had "quarries". Babylon didn't. So Babylon was building with what they had. So this is just another childish admiration.

Oh god, how juvenile is the pre-history of Genesis. About the only thing it doesn't say is that when it thunders that means that God is bowling.

08-09-2003, 02:08 PM	#1
notMichaelJackson Banned Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: IL Posts: 552	YEC history books? If the world is only six thousand years old, then not only were our high school biology books wrong, but history books, as well. Do YECs write history books to suit their biases? A quick Yahoo search gives us this page, which claims some pyramids were constructed around 2500 BC. YECs claim that the Flood occured at that time.

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08-09-2003, 02:58 PM	#2
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	One of the questions that bothered me when I was an Orthodox Jewish young-earth creationist was the origin of the races. The Bible accounts only for Middle-Easterners (Shem), North Africans (Ham) and Europeans (Japheth). The rest of humanity, such as the Chinese, and not to mention the natives of America and Australia, are unaccounted for. My rabbis were at a loss to answer those questions of mine. In the end I had to accept that the Bible could not write but about the world known to its writers. Which means a human-sized, not a God-sized, authorship. There went Bible inerrancy, and my departure from Orthodox Judaism wasn't far off.

08-10-2003, 02:59 AM	#3
AJ the greek Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: out there Posts: 140	try www.bjup.com Bob Jones Press or www.abeka.com Pensacola Christian College Both are big players in the homeschool world, you can rest assured that their biases are suited.

08-10-2003, 08:15 AM	#5
Roland Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: California Posts: 748	Interesting. According to the Bible, all languages derive from the Tower of Babel incident around 2200 B.C. Yet, we have at least two languages (The Egyptian and the Sumerian) existing at least 1000 years before that time.

08-10-2003, 08:44 AM	#6
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	Oh, don't get me started about the Tower of Babel! That's one of the prominent areas where the folk-tale of Genesis just melts down in the face of the true, evolutionary account. Languages evolve and speciate before our very historical eyes. Speciation is when two speakers are no longer mutually intelligible. Italian, Romanian and Portuguese are three descendants of Latin that underwent speciation and are now no longer mutually intelligible. And all by natural means - just through mutating along the generations. Not to mention the various Indo-European branches, like English and Russian, which are much more remote than the Latin derivatives. Except for a few core-words (family nouns and numerals), English and Russian have speciated to the point that they seem as unrelated as Chinese and Mayan. If speech-mutation through time can do this to previously related languages, why assume that a divine act of speech confusion was needed to make the first mutually unintelligible language species? Biblical literalism, in its YEC kind, demands not only the reformation of biology, astronomy and even history, but also a radical reformation of linguistics. I wonder how many linguists take Scientific Babelism seriously. There is no dispute whatsoever in the linguistic community that languages are the product of [Lamarckian] evolution. Unlike biology, where I am still a beginner, linguistics is an area of science I really know well about, having studied it from early childhood.

08-11-2003, 07:48 AM	#8
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	Scientific Babelism is from here.

08-11-2003, 08:16 AM	#9
DMB Guest Posts: n/a	Thanks for the link. It's a beautiful article.

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