Freethought & Rationalism Archive

ps418 · 08-10-2002, 07:29 AM

I hadn't seen these articles at <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org" target="_blank">talk.design</a> yet, so I assume many of you haven't either. I liked the review of Phillip Johnson's Darwin on Trial, <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/johnson.html" target="_blank">The Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing but the Truth?,</a> and the article on <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/Evolving_Immunity.html" target="_blank">Evolving Immunity</a> is very interesting too.

[ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: ps418 ]

tgamble · 08-10-2002, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ps418:
I hadn't seen these articles at <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org" target="_blank">talk.design</a> yet, so I assume many of you haven't either. I liked the review of Phillip Johnson's Darwin on Trial, <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/johnson.html" target="_blank">The Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing but the Truth?,</a> and the article on <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/Evolving_Immunity.html" target="_blank">Evolving Immunity</a> is very interesting too.

[ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: ps418 ]

That one on Johnson is great! Has it been posted on arn?

pz · 08-10-2002, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tgamble:


That one on Johnson is great! Has it been posted on arn?

Oh, yeah, right...as if the moderators there would let it slip by.

tgamble · 08-10-2002, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ps418:
It is useless to try to explain science to someone who isn't interested in what the facts have to say. And it's useless to try to learn anything from such people. If they are clever, as Johnson is, they can find a way to claim that almost any fact supports their position. If evolutionists agree on something, it's a dogmatic orthodoxy; if they disagree, they're squabbling about every detail of evolutionary theory. If a piece of evidence seems to count against evolution, evolution has been disproven; if it seems to count for evolution, that merely shows that evolution is unfalsifiable. If scientists state that they are personally atheistic, they are clearly exposing the rotten metaphysical heart of evolution; if they state that they are religious, they are clearly trying to cover the rotten heart up. If we learn anything new, it's evidence that our current theory is completely false; if what we learn is exactly what we expected, it's only because we were precommitted to finding it in the first place. If we point out where creationists are wrong, we are persecuting the underdog; if we ignore them, we are refusing to face the fact that they're right. If a piece of evidence supports one part of evolutionary theory, it doesn't support that other part. If we find a strong piece of evidence for evolution, there ought to be more just like it. If an evolutionist speaks out in favor of Darwinism, it's because they were strong-armed into it; if they say anything which can be taken out of context to suggest any skepticism about evolution, it's resounding proof that nobody in science believes the theory.

Now that sums up the whole argument perfectly!

Camaban · 08-10-2002, 03:52 PM

*applause*

Bubba · 08-11-2002, 08:47 AM

<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" />

Bubba

Albion · 08-11-2002, 11:40 AM

I particularly liked the conclusion at the end of that section:

""Intelligent design" creationists complain that our society's morals are being eroded because schoolchildren are being taught to think like scientists. God help our society's values if we teach our kids to think like Phillip Johnson."

rafe gutman · 08-12-2002, 04:54 PM

speaking of talkdesign.org, they have a forum there. it doesn't get much business, but a lot of the threads are not meant to be discussions, but rather places to post information on a particular topic. for example, check out this thread, <a href="http://www.antievolution.org/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?s=3d5858b43e35ffff;act=ST;f=9;t=1" target="_blank">Invidious comparisons, The polemics of "intelligent design"</a>, where they collect quotes of IDists trying to equate evolution with something negative, like nazis.

08-10-2002, 07:29 AM	#1
ps418 Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Louisville, KY, USA Posts: 1,840	Articles at Talk.Design I hadn't seen these articles at <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org" target="_blank">talk.design</a> yet, so I assume many of you haven't either. I liked the review of Phillip Johnson's Darwin on Trial, <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/johnson.html" target="_blank">The Truth, the Whole Truth, and Nothing but the Truth?,</a> and the article on <a href="http://www.talkdesign.org/faqs/Evolving_Immunity.html" target="_blank">Evolving Immunity</a> is very interesting too. [ August 10, 2002: Message edited by: ps418 ]</p>

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08-10-2002, 03:52 PM	#5
Camaban Regular Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 473	applause

08-11-2002, 08:47 AM	#6
Bubba Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Orient, OH USA Posts: 1,501	<img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> <img src="graemlins/notworthy.gif" border="0" alt="[Not Worthy]" /> Bubba

08-11-2002, 11:40 AM	#7
Albion Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: US east coast. And www.theroyalforums.com Posts: 2,829	I particularly liked the conclusion at the end of that section: ""Intelligent design" creationists complain that our society's morals are being eroded because schoolchildren are being taught to think like scientists. God help our society's values if we teach our kids to think like Phillip Johnson."

08-12-2002, 04:54 PM	#8
rafe gutman Junior Member Join Date: May 2001 Location: La Jolla, CA Posts: 72	speaking of talkdesign.org, they have a forum there. it doesn't get much business, but a lot of the threads are not meant to be discussions, but rather places to post information on a particular topic. for example, check out this thread, <a href="http://www.antievolution.org/cgi-bin/ikonboard/ikonboard.cgi?s=3d5858b43e35ffff;act=ST;f=9;t=1" target="_blank">Invidious comparisons, The polemics of "intelligent design"</a>, where they collect quotes of IDists trying to equate evolution with something negative, like nazis.

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