Freethought & Rationalism Archive

christ-on-a-stick · 02-10-2002, 09:24 AM

Hi everyone, I am a relatively new poster here.

I threw this analogy out to my super-fundy mom the other day and wanted to know what you guys thought.

During our discussion, I will often make allusions to the fact that, according to her beliefs, the "Loving Father God" will send people to hell for all eternity. Her response is always that God doesn't send anyone to hell, they send THEMSELVES to hell by choosing not to believe; they have a choice, and so if they choose the wrong one they are bringing the consequences upon themselves, not God.

So the other day I replied:

"How would you feel if... you were walking through the park one day, and a man grabbed you, held a knife to your throat, and said "spread your legs or I'll cut your throat!", so you comply, and he rapes you and lets you go. You run to the nearest police station and tell them what happenned... but they refuse to take a police report for rape. Why? Well, you CHOSE to spread your legs - so it wasn't rape. You reply, "but he was holding a knife to my throat!" and they insist, it was your free choice. He didn't force your legs apart, you opened them voluntarily because you didn't want to have your throat cut".

Essentially, I went on, we don't consider things a "free choice" when there is a real threat of violence involved. It's called coercion, or terrorism, or force by threat - not a "free choice".

And yet this is what Christians would have us believe.

Any comments? Or do most of you agree that by Christian's definition of choice, God (if he existed) would be the Great Cosmic Rapist?

christ-on-a-stick · 02-10-2002, 09:29 AM

Duh - I forgot the second part (not enough coffee yet!)

Alternately, in the rape scenario, you refuse to open your legs and he slices your throat and you die. The perp is caught... but not convicted, because witnesses back up his story that... HE GAVE YOU A CHOICE.

So obviously, you chose to have your throat cut... not his reponsibility!

So now God is a Murdering Cosmic Rapist.

emotional · 02-10-2002, 10:29 AM

Hear, hear.

The God of the Bible, New Testament and Qur'an is a weak being indeed; he cannot win over followers by rational, intellectual or compassionate persuasion, so instead he resorts to threats of inflicting pain. Indeed this evil fiend of a God is a role model for school bullies worldwide.

God be damned! Damned! Damned!
In Hell for eternity!

02-10-2002, 09:24 AM	#1
christ-on-a-stick Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Durango, Colorado Posts: 7,116	God, the Great Cosmic Rapist??? Hi everyone, I am a relatively new poster here. I threw this analogy out to my super-fundy mom the other day and wanted to know what you guys thought. During our discussion, I will often make allusions to the fact that, according to her beliefs, the "Loving Father God" will send people to hell for all eternity. Her response is always that God doesn't send anyone to hell, they send THEMSELVES to hell by choosing not to believe; they have a choice, and so if they choose the wrong one they are bringing the consequences upon themselves, not God. So the other day I replied: "How would you feel if... you were walking through the park one day, and a man grabbed you, held a knife to your throat, and said "spread your legs or I'll cut your throat!", so you comply, and he rapes you and lets you go. You run to the nearest police station and tell them what happenned... but they refuse to take a police report for rape. Why? Well, you CHOSE to spread your legs - so it wasn't rape. You reply, "but he was holding a knife to my throat!" and they insist, it was your free choice. He didn't force your legs apart, you opened them voluntarily because you didn't want to have your throat cut". Essentially, I went on, we don't consider things a "free choice" when there is a real threat of violence involved. It's called coercion, or terrorism, or force by threat - not a "free choice". And yet this is what Christians would have us believe. Any comments? Or do most of you agree that by Christian's definition of choice, God (if he existed) would be the Great Cosmic Rapist?

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02-10-2002, 09:29 AM	#2
christ-on-a-stick Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Durango, Colorado Posts: 7,116	Duh - I forgot the second part (not enough coffee yet!) Alternately, in the rape scenario, you refuse to open your legs and he slices your throat and you die. The perp is caught... but not convicted, because witnesses back up his story that... HE GAVE YOU A CHOICE. So obviously, you chose to have your throat cut... not his reponsibility! So now God is a Murdering Cosmic Rapist.

02-10-2002, 10:29 AM	#3
emotional Banned Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Boxing ring of HaShem, Jesus and Allah Posts: 1,945	Hear, hear. The God of the Bible, New Testament and Qur'an is a weak being indeed; he cannot win over followers by rational, intellectual or compassionate persuasion, so instead he resorts to threats of inflicting pain. Indeed this evil fiend of a God is a role model for school bullies worldwide. God be damned! Damned! Damned! In Hell for eternity!

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