Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Hayden · 06-04-2002, 01:06 AM

I was flicking through BaptistBoards when I came across the following:

Quote:

You say that becasue the state says it's ok, then it's ok. So does everything the state says is alright actually alright then?
What about the laws that keep christians from bowing their heads in silent prayer in court houses? What about abortion? The state allows a lot of things that are not biblical, because the state does not belief in the biblical God.

(The original quote can be found <a href="http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=001364;p=4" target="_blank">here</a>, at the bottom of the 3rd post, by katie.)

Surely this isn't true?

HR

GaryP · 06-04-2002, 01:57 AM

There is no court decision I am aware of that would keep Americans from praying silently (or otherwise) in their courthouse or any other house.

This is just an example of the hyperbole some people engage in. They tend to project whatever prohibitions there are on government officials leading prayer to a prohibition on all prayer.

The only way they could get in trouble would be if they did it in a very disorderly or "in your face" manner.

Panta Pei · 06-04-2002, 02:04 AM

No, HR, it's true

When I was commissioned as a law enforcement officer for the State, my cerebellum was fitted with a tiny device that allows me to discern the thoughts of Christians in all courthouses.

I can, thereby, determine the exact difference between when they are fomenting a silent prayer to Jesus or simply dozing off like they do in church.

[ June 04, 2002: Message edited by: Panta Pei ]

tragic_pizza · 06-04-2002, 05:21 AM

Again, it's why that section is a "Baptist only" area. Perish forbid they're disabused of their most dearly held misconceptions...

<img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

Emotional Naturalist · 06-05-2002, 08:51 PM

They can pray if they want, but they should abstain from doing it in infidel company, because it might hurt someone's feelings. I for one am grievously hurt when I see people praying to God.

tragic_pizza · 06-06-2002, 05:45 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Emotional Naturalist:
They can pray if they want, but they should abstain from doing it in infidel company, because it might hurt someone's feelings. I for one am grievously hurt when I see people praying to God.

<img src="graemlins/boohoo.gif" border="0" alt="[Boo Hoo]" />

Sorry, it needed to be done. Why are you "grievously hurt?"

Toto · 06-06-2002, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tragic_pizza:

Why are you "grievously hurt?"

I wondered this myself. Is this sarcastic? If so, it needs a smiley to indicate that.

If a person engages in some sort of silent prayer in my presence, I just assume he is performing some private ritual that does something for him, and I figure it's none of my business. If the prayer is loud, it is impolite, because my natural instinct is to dissent, and social mores force me to suppress that instinct. I don't know if Miss Manners has pontificated on this, but it seems the rule most people follow is don't put your beliefs out in public unless you are willing to hear them criticized.

rage · 06-06-2002, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hayden Rogers:
I was flicking through BaptistBoards when I came across the following:

(The original quote can be found <a href="http://www.baptistboard.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=10;t=001364;p=4" target="_blank">here</a>, at the bottom of the 3rd post, by katie.)

Surely this isn't true?

HR

In speaking/debating with some people around this bible belt area, they seem to believe that to be true about schools.

They believe that taking prayer out of school means that students can't even do it silently or on their own. Most christians around here(especially the southern baptists

) don't seem to get the concept that students can pray themselves to death, as long as it is not being lead by a teacher or other government affiliated employee (or as long as it is not being encouraged/endorsed/sponsored by the same people).

GaryP · 06-06-2002, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rage:


They believe that taking prayer out of school means that students can't even do it silently or on their own. Most christians around here(especially the southern baptists

) don't seem to get the concept that students can pray themselves to death, as long as it is not being lead by a teacher or other government affiliated employee (or as long as it is not being encouraged/endorsed/sponsored by the same people).

Say Hallelujia!! That's true around here in Southern Ohio also.

Emotional Naturalist · 06-06-2002, 10:59 PM

Sultan Abdul Hamid was the Ottoman Turkish ruler who presided over the massacre of the Armenians at the beginning of the 20th century. I'm sure an Armenian wouldn't take kindly to words of praise being said in honour of that sultan, even if they were in whispers, silently.

For me, I'm the Armenian and God is Sultan Abdul Hamid. Praising God is effectively doing homage to the one who massacred my people (and still is!). I have no obligation to tolerate that. It must stop. So, had I the power, I would forbid all praise of God, because it hurts my infidel feelings. Surely those who object to taking the Lord's name in vain because it hurts their feelings would understand a similar feeling on the part of an infidel, wouldn't they? They'll learn to respect my feelings, or they shall taste my wrath, in the form of profaned religious articles and other things that wouldn't make their day.

There must be symmetry. If theists don't allow atheists to use the word "God" whenever they wish ("in vain"), then atheists shouldn't allow theists to praise God whenever they wish. They shall respect infidels' feelings or learn it the hard way.

(edited to add obligatory signature) Atheism and secular law alone: no negotiations, no conferences and no dialogues.

[ June 07, 2002: Message edited by: Emotional Naturalist ]

06-04-2002, 02:04 AM	#3
Panta Pei Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: in the middle of things Posts: 722	No, HR, it's true When I was commissioned as a law enforcement officer for the State, my cerebellum was fitted with a tiny device that allows me to discern the thoughts of Christians in all courthouses. I can, thereby, determine the exact difference between when they are fomenting a silent prayer to Jesus or simply dozing off like they do in church. [ June 04, 2002: Message edited by: Panta Pei ]</p>

06-06-2002, 10:59 PM	#10
Emotional Naturalist Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: hell's flames Posts: 26	Sultan Abdul Hamid was the Ottoman Turkish ruler who presided over the massacre of the Armenians at the beginning of the 20th century. I'm sure an Armenian wouldn't take kindly to words of praise being said in honour of that sultan, even if they were in whispers, silently. For me, I'm the Armenian and God is Sultan Abdul Hamid. Praising God is effectively doing homage to the one who massacred my people (and still is!). I have no obligation to tolerate that. It must stop. So, had I the power, I would forbid all praise of God, because it hurts my infidel feelings. Surely those who object to taking the Lord's name in vain because it hurts their feelings would understand a similar feeling on the part of an infidel, wouldn't they? They'll learn to respect my feelings, or they shall taste my wrath, in the form of profaned religious articles and other things that wouldn't make their day. There must be symmetry. If theists don't allow atheists to use the word "God" whenever they wish ("in vain"), then atheists shouldn't allow theists to praise God whenever they wish. They shall respect infidels' feelings or learn it the hard way. (edited to add obligatory signature) Atheism and secular law alone: no negotiations, no conferences and no dialogues. [ June 07, 2002: Message edited by: Emotional Naturalist ]</p>

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06-04-2002, 01:57 AM	#2
GaryP Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Lancaster, OH Posts: 1,792	There is no court decision I am aware of that would keep Americans from praying silently (or otherwise) in their courthouse or any other house. This is just an example of the hyperbole some people engage in. They tend to project whatever prohibitions there are on government officials leading prayer to a prohibition on all prayer. The only way they could get in trouble would be if they did it in a very disorderly or "in your face" manner.

06-04-2002, 05:21 AM	#4
tragic_pizza Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 108	Again, it's why that section is a "Baptist only" area. Perish forbid they're disabused of their most dearly held misconceptions... <img src="graemlins/banghead.gif" border="0" alt="[Bang Head]" />

06-05-2002, 08:51 PM	#5
Emotional Naturalist Banned Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: hell's flames Posts: 26	They can pray if they want, but they should abstain from doing it in infidel company, because it might hurt someone's feelings. I for one am grievously hurt when I see people praying to God.

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