Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Jewel · 06-08-2003, 06:35 AM

Project Reality?????? It's more like Project Not in Touch With Reality.

06-08-2003, 11:36 AM

The title of this thread might well be Abstinence-only sex ed heads its ugly rear once again.

SLD · 06-08-2003, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JonathanChance
Well, back when I was in high school in rural Northeast Wisconsin (1994-1998), This was sex ed as taught in Freshman Health class and a class called Social Problems that was taken by Juniors and Seniors (both of which required one's parents to sign a permission slip to take):

Don't do it, don't do it, don't do it, dont do it, These are STD and here is how they spread, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it, homosexuality are, in general confused, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it, you might get pregnant! Don't do it, don't do it, don't do it abstinence is the only 100% way to be sure you don't get pregnant or contract an STD, don't do it, don't do it, don't do it, condoms are not effective*,

. . . .

*Our health class and the Social Problems classes gave us some bullshit statistics on condom failiure rates that hadn't been up to date since 1983. From what I have been able to gather form people who recently graduated, these statistics are still in use, despite the fact that they are now two decades old.

Well, Duh. If they don't work, why use them?

SLD

Lohan · 06-08-2003, 10:10 PM

I go to a Jesuit high school, so I had one of these beauts this year a couple of months ago. Their persuasive skills, were simply put, very good. They certainly had charisma, and I had no doubt it was for this reason that they kept being invited to schools around the country, and not for the accuracy of the "facts" they gave in their talk.

They pushed the lack of effectiveness of condoms story pretty hard. The guy (it was a guy and his fiance, the guy was a grad of my high school in fact) even claimed to have heard some tape that had a bunch of doctors talking in an AMA conference about covering up how condoms didn't stop STDs so teens would still have lots of sex. Umm, motive

? I guess all the doctors are just in a great conspiracy with Trojan to make sure condoms sell well and to kill Bush Jr., among other devious activities meant to undermine good old American morality.

Then they went on to some sensationalist story of this new wave of human papilloma virus that was sweeping the country and threatening to infect every teen who so much as thought of touching a member of the opposite sex (or same sex for that matter). Frankly I was unimpressed by this whole HPV story and their notion that it could be transmitted by ANY human contact from knees to elbows.

Being the skeptical soul that I am, I went in checked the Planned Parenthood site after the presentation (which they duly mocked as an evil incarnation of Satan) and found that my doubts were well-founded. Yes, ANIMAL SKIN condoms have been shown to be not so effective at preventing STD transmission, but LATEX condoms are proven very effective. And I simply could not verify this HPV plague threatening to afflict the nation's teens with throat warts and other unpleasant side effects. Not to say that HPV doesn't exist, just that it doesn't seem to be that big of a threat to anyone's life.

They also had some thing about preserving girl's innocence by not "shoving your genitals into her mouth" and other such comments.

I'm not one to take sex lightly, and I wouldn't go around nailing anything that moves (thats a female human anyway) but clowns like this pair running around blurting half truths and not presenting any useful information for people that do plan to have sex and should be informed of its risks so they can protect themselves should be treated like the circuses they are. Thank the IPU that such information is readily available from other sources.

[Edited to fix a sentence fragment]

dangin · 06-09-2003, 10:57 AM

They are making a big deal out of HPV now, and rightly so. Estimates have between 30 and 60 percent of sexually active adults between 20 and 40 have one type of this or another.

Little bumps on your package may not be that big a deal, but the link between HPV and cancer is serious. Colon and Uterine cancer suck, and HPV (combined with other risk factors like smoking and drinking) is being demonstrated to increase the risk of those cancers significantly.

It doesn't make abstinence right, but don't blow off HPV. A vaccine may be on the horizon but so far only for women. The message of all of this is be careful, and do wear a condom. With HPV that prevalent you may wind up in a relationship with someone who is positive and doesn't even know it.

Lohan · 06-09-2003, 12:56 PM

Thanks for the clarification. I was skeptical about their claims because of all the other bullshit layering everything else they said. That's a shame that whatever legitimate dangers those two presented for buried underneath the dog and pony show they were running about condoms and God and everything else.

lpetrich · 06-10-2003, 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dangin
... It doesn't make abstinence right, but don't blow off HPV. A vaccine may be on the horizon but so far only for women. The message of all of this is be careful, and do wear a condom. ...

How about encouraging nonpenetrative sex acts? Why does there seem to be a conspiracy of silence about them?

dangin · 06-10-2003, 06:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lpetrich
How about encouraging nonpenetrative sex acts? Why does there seem to be a conspiracy of silence about them?

Hallelujah. But don't forget, these are the kind of people who got one of Clinton's Surgeon Generals ousted because she encouraged masturbation. Who believes that masturbation is a sin? Today, in 2003, who's going to tell me that masturbation is "bad"? Does Guinnes have an entry for the world record in denial?

Elora · 06-11-2003, 12:21 AM

Took me about ten full minutes to stop alternately shaking my head and laughing my ass off. Project Alternate Reality, more like, where no one lusts in their heart and all people live their happy lives in polo shirts and perfect families. :banghead:

Yay for Orange County, my home, rejecting this crap! I don't care how religious you are, teach your own kids that waiting is better (which I often believe is true, especially with teens). But recognize that other parents aren't going to be doing the same, and it's in your best interests to make sure their kids aren't catching STD's and unintentionally getting pregnant. Read all the studies conducted and then try to tell me that abstinence programs are accomplishing those goals.

Rios? Sandy Rios? The head of--excuse me while I roll my eyes--Concerned Women of America? I just saw an article where she commends Ashcroft for preventing a Gay Pride event at the DoJ. Crazy woman sure does get around, doesn't she?

Jewel · 06-11-2003, 05:11 AM

Good for Orange County for seeing through that crap!

I think it would be great if some industrius student(s) came to class prepared with the proper statistics and literature about STD's and contraceptives and challenged them and their backward crap. Not by being belligerent, of course, but surely they have a question and answer session.

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06-08-2003, 06:35 AM	#31
Jewel Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Northern Virginia, USA Posts: 1,112	Project Reality?????? It's more like Project Not in Touch With Reality.

06-08-2003, 11:36 AM	#32
DMB Guest Posts: n/a	The title of this thread might well be Abstinence-only sex ed heads its ugly rear once again.

06-08-2003, 10:10 PM	#34
Lohan Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Somewhere far beyond Posts: 57	I go to a Jesuit high school, so I had one of these beauts this year a couple of months ago. Their persuasive skills, were simply put, very good. They certainly had charisma, and I had no doubt it was for this reason that they kept being invited to schools around the country, and not for the accuracy of the "facts" they gave in their talk. They pushed the lack of effectiveness of condoms story pretty hard. The guy (it was a guy and his fiance, the guy was a grad of my high school in fact) even claimed to have heard some tape that had a bunch of doctors talking in an AMA conference about covering up how condoms didn't stop STDs so teens would still have lots of sex. Umm, motive ? I guess all the doctors are just in a great conspiracy with Trojan to make sure condoms sell well and to kill Bush Jr., among other devious activities meant to undermine good old American morality. Then they went on to some sensationalist story of this new wave of human papilloma virus that was sweeping the country and threatening to infect every teen who so much as thought of touching a member of the opposite sex (or same sex for that matter). Frankly I was unimpressed by this whole HPV story and their notion that it could be transmitted by ANY human contact from knees to elbows. Being the skeptical soul that I am, I went in checked the Planned Parenthood site after the presentation (which they duly mocked as an evil incarnation of Satan) and found that my doubts were well-founded. Yes, ANIMAL SKIN condoms have been shown to be not so effective at preventing STD transmission, but LATEX condoms are proven very effective. And I simply could not verify this HPV plague threatening to afflict the nation's teens with throat warts and other unpleasant side effects. Not to say that HPV doesn't exist, just that it doesn't seem to be that big of a threat to anyone's life. They also had some thing about preserving girl's innocence by not "shoving your genitals into her mouth" and other such comments. I'm not one to take sex lightly, and I wouldn't go around nailing anything that moves (thats a female human anyway) but clowns like this pair running around blurting half truths and not presenting any useful information for people that do plan to have sex and should be informed of its risks so they can protect themselves should be treated like the circuses they are. Thank the IPU that such information is readily available from other sources. [Edited to fix a sentence fragment]

06-09-2003, 10:57 AM	#35
dangin Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2000 Location: The Middle, Kansas Posts: 2,637	They are making a big deal out of HPV now, and rightly so. Estimates have between 30 and 60 percent of sexually active adults between 20 and 40 have one type of this or another. Little bumps on your package may not be that big a deal, but the link between HPV and cancer is serious. Colon and Uterine cancer suck, and HPV (combined with other risk factors like smoking and drinking) is being demonstrated to increase the risk of those cancers significantly. It doesn't make abstinence right, but don't blow off HPV. A vaccine may be on the horizon but so far only for women. The message of all of this is be careful, and do wear a condom. With HPV that prevalent you may wind up in a relationship with someone who is positive and doesn't even know it.

06-09-2003, 12:56 PM	#36
Lohan Junior Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Somewhere far beyond Posts: 57	Thanks for the clarification. I was skeptical about their claims because of all the other bullshit layering everything else they said. That's a shame that whatever legitimate dangers those two presented for buried underneath the dog and pony show they were running about condoms and God and everything else.

06-11-2003, 12:21 AM	#39
Elora Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 58	Took me about ten full minutes to stop alternately shaking my head and laughing my ass off. Project Alternate Reality, more like, where no one lusts in their heart and all people live their happy lives in polo shirts and perfect families. :banghead: Yay for Orange County, my home, rejecting this crap! I don't care how religious you are, teach your own kids that waiting is better (which I often believe is true, especially with teens). But recognize that other parents aren't going to be doing the same, and it's in your best interests to make sure their kids aren't catching STD's and unintentionally getting pregnant. Read all the studies conducted and then try to tell me that abstinence programs are accomplishing those goals. Rios? Sandy Rios? The head of--excuse me while I roll my eyes--Concerned Women of America? I just saw an article where she commends Ashcroft for preventing a Gay Pride event at the DoJ. Crazy woman sure does get around, doesn't she?

06-11-2003, 05:11 AM	#40
Jewel Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Northern Virginia, USA Posts: 1,112	Good for Orange County for seeing through that crap! I think it would be great if some industrius student(s) came to class prepared with the proper statistics and literature about STD's and contraceptives and challenged them and their backward crap. Not by being belligerent, of course, but surely they have a question and answer session.

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