Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Solsticin · 11-20-2002, 02:02 PM

I think they meant "cunning linguists" ... now I see the problem!

Serioulsy though, this sucks.

Ron Garrett · 11-20-2002, 02:27 PM

As a DLI grad myself (a cunning linguist mind you)I know how much money goes into clearing and training these people, how hard it is to maintain enlistments and skills, and that this MOS is usually 40-80% under strength. Booting guys out for being gay is nonsense, and even more so when we need Arabic lingies like never before. Heck, the honor grad of my cycle (beat me by one point, the bastard) was gay and got booted right after graduation. A comlpete waste of money and manpower. In fact, there were gays all over the intelligence agencies everywhere I went, whether ASA, INSCOM, NSG, AFSS, NSA or what have you. Hell, at the start of Afghanistan they offered reactivation as a field grade officer to one of my lesbian friends who just had an artificial insem baby with her lesbian partner (and the commander offering her the slot knew it). So this policy is not enforced uniformly and I doubt if many of the commanders still see this as a moral issue, morale issue or any issue at all. The sooner this bullshit discrimination goes away the better, but we'll never see the executive order it will require out of the Shrub.

NialScorva · 11-22-2002, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Shadowy Man:
Not really, because you can not get your security clearance for really dumb reasons that have nothing to do with your trustworthiness or loyalty to the country.

Such as?

I'm going through the process now, and am surrounded by people who have gone through it that I bug incessantly about the process. <a href="http://www.dss.mil/nf/adr/supinfo/supinfF.htm" target="_blank">The guidelines for adjudication</a> are freely available, and the person being investigated is told what potential problems are being looked at in his history. From what I've gathered, there are two big things that the average person would need to worry about:

1. Withholding information from the investigators.

2. Poor at managing finances, extremely heavy debt without any attempt to manage it.

The first implies that you can be blackmailed because there is something that you don't want found out, and the second implies that you can be bought. If there's any hint that you can be blackmailed or bought, then you have no business working with classified information.

Splat · 11-22-2002, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Nataraja:
Come to think of it, though, being AWOL is an offense punishable by anything from a reprimand to execution (no fucking kidding).

Or, if you're Dubya, they make you grow up to be president.

MortalWombat · 11-22-2002, 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Splat:


Or, if you're Dubya, they make you grow up to be president.

<a href="http://www.boston.com/news/politics/campaign2000/news/One_year_gap_in_Bush_s_Guard_duty+.shtml" target="_blank">Here</a> is what Splat is talking about, in case anyone is wondering. (Not that I would blame anyone for not knowing Bush's poor military service record; while there were <a href="http://www.uaw.org/cap/01/news/day3media.html" target="_blank">over 13,000 news stories about Clinton's draft-dodging, there were only 49 about Bush's desertion</a>.)

Shadowy Man · 11-22-2002, 11:25 AM

NialScorva:

Well, my brother had pretty bad credit, including large student loans - which is part of the reason he joined the Army - to pay them off! So, that's probably less of an issue.

Basically, don't lie about anything! He said they are more concerned about you being truthful about your past than your past itself. You need to be proven trustworthy, so own up to everything.

[ November 22, 2002: Message edited by: Shadowy Man ]

11-22-2002, 11:25 AM	#16
Shadowy Man Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: A Shadowy Planet Posts: 7,585	NialScorva: Well, my brother had pretty bad credit, including large student loans - which is part of the reason he joined the Army - to pay them off! So, that's probably less of an issue. Basically, don't lie about anything! He said they are more concerned about you being truthful about your past than your past itself. You need to be proven trustworthy, so own up to everything. [ November 22, 2002: Message edited by: Shadowy Man ]</p>

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11-20-2002, 02:02 PM	#11
Solsticin Regular Member Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Grand Prairie, Texas Posts: 435	I think they meant "cunning linguists" ... now I see the problem! Serioulsy though, this sucks.

11-20-2002, 02:27 PM	#12
Ron Garrett Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: United States Posts: 1,657	As a DLI grad myself (a cunning linguist mind you)I know how much money goes into clearing and training these people, how hard it is to maintain enlistments and skills, and that this MOS is usually 40-80% under strength. Booting guys out for being gay is nonsense, and even more so when we need Arabic lingies like never before. Heck, the honor grad of my cycle (beat me by one point, the bastard) was gay and got booted right after graduation. A comlpete waste of money and manpower. In fact, there were gays all over the intelligence agencies everywhere I went, whether ASA, INSCOM, NSG, AFSS, NSA or what have you. Hell, at the start of Afghanistan they offered reactivation as a field grade officer to one of my lesbian friends who just had an artificial insem baby with her lesbian partner (and the commander offering her the slot knew it). So this policy is not enforced uniformly and I doubt if many of the commanders still see this as a moral issue, morale issue or any issue at all. The sooner this bullshit discrimination goes away the better, but we'll never see the executive order it will require out of the Shrub.

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