GunnerJ

Pfft. Like we can't do both at the same time!

St. Robert

If someone hears the Gospel and rejects it as true, then they would have been better off never hearing it at all.

GunnerJ

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Yes. Very good. That's our whole point. Given that a large protion of the people who hear it would likely reject it (simple probability suggests 50%) then why the hell would Jesus have commanded people to evangelize? It doesn't make sense of Xianity is true. It makes perfect sense if it's false.

Evil Milkman

I'm thinking that perhaps I should post this message on a Christian forum so I can get more input. Robert seems to be the only theist participating.

Kosh

I think maybe I'll start a class action lawsuit on behalf of all the doubters who are suffering stress at whether they made the right decision. Stress brought on solely by the Christian decision to force the witness. Stress that could have been avoided if we were left alone.

And we even have expert testimony now that they were wrong to witness to us!

After all, St.Robert is a True Christian (tm).

Stephen Maturin

Okay, but what about the people who reject it as false?

Copernic

Bingo!! And not just those who reject it as true, but also those who failed to completely understand it as well as those who were witnessed too poorly.

A reasonable Christain response would be, I suppose, that only those who have heard the the Gospel are responsible for their knowledge.
Thus relieving the ignorant (never heard it) and weak minded (didn't understand it) from eternal damnation. Many Christians (who bother to think about it) feel comfortable with this.

So, St. Robert, suppose one of your ilk decides to witness to me. How much witnessing is required to make me responsible for "Gospel Knowledge?"

Is there a quantifiable amount? During the conversation, am I safe until I hear a divine egg timer go off and from then on, if I then reject what I'm told I should expect to go to hell whereas before I was home free to go to the same Heaven as you?

I too wish there were more theists in this conversation, because I'm interested in what different Xtian sects have to offer on this point. Has this subject been beaten to death without my seeing it discussed before, or is it considered theologically vacuous?

St. Robert, thanks for hanging with us.

J

lpetrich

The Bible contradicts itself in several places; consider who was at Jesus Christ's resurrection -- all four Gospels contradict each other. And consider the genealogies of Matthew and Luke -- almost NO names in common. And consider Noah's Flood -- was 1 pair or 7 pairs of clean animals taken aboard the Ark. And consider Genesis 1 and 2:

G1: God is very, very happy with what he has done
G2: God seems rather exasperated at his troublesome creation

G1: Everything else before humanity (both sexes created at the same time)
G2: The first man, then all the animals, then the first woman (from the first man!)

lpetrich

Places like Saudi Arabia, whose leaders claim that that is a false religion.

Muslims will tell you all about Jesus Christ and how he was a predecessor of Mohammed instead of someone who had died for anyone's sins. In fact, the Koran tells us that some phantom had been crucified instead of Jesus Christ himself.

St. Robert

People will typically chose to believe a lie before they will accept the truth.

Jesus was sure of His identity and His mission. He lovingly told people the truth about themselves and about His Father even if it meant being brutally executed. Christ died on the cross for the sinners, so that we could be transformed by His Spirit into saints. God the Father has made it ridiculously easy to get into Heaven: 'Say yes to my Son and follow Him.'