FRDB Archives

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.


Go Back   FRDB Archives > Archives > IIDB ARCHIVE: 200X-2003, PD 2007 > IIDB Philosophical Forums (PRIOR TO JUN-2003)
Welcome, Peter Kirby.
You last visited: Yesterday at 05:55 AM

 
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 01-24-2002, 06:20 AM   #11
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: europe
Posts: 111
Post

yet another site on Jiahad fot those who want to know the truth of the matter.

study well.


<a href="http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/showsubcategory.jsp?display=on&cat=18" target="_blank">http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/showsubcategory.jsp?display=on&cat=18</a>
jojo-sa is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 10:50 AM   #12
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 1,258
Post

Quote:
Originally posted by Waning Moon Conrad:
<strong>I believe that Islam is a threat to democracy, to freedom, to culture and to education.

I also believe that one day there will be war, the rest of Humanity versus Islam.

Islam will lose but western nations will bitterly regret ever having allowed Muslims to immigrate.

</strong>
The same can be said of Christianity as well. It cost us 1500 years of developement.
Orpheous99 is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 10:51 AM   #13
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada
Posts: 1,258
Post

Quote:
Originally posted by jojo-sa:
<strong>yet another site on Jiahad fot those who want to know the truth of the matter.

study well.


<a href="http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/showsubcategory.jsp?display=on&cat=18" target="_blank">http://www.understanding-islam.com/related/showsubcategory.jsp?display=on&cat=18</a></strong>
And whose truth would that be? There is very little actual truth in religious belief.
Orpheous99 is offline  
Old 01-24-2002, 11:15 AM   #14
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: NY
Posts: 72
Post

The main difference between Islam and other all too human justification for aggression (ie Manifest destiny, honor of the Fatherland etc...) is the tie between a muslim's faith and the success of Islamic forces. After the Arab fury was unleashed in the 7th century, Muhhammed's followers built an Empire as large as Alexander's. Continued success created a belief that the "faithful" were indeed favored by Allah -proven by the success on the field of Battle.

Even after disasters, for example, when the Abbassid Capitol Bagdad fell to the Mongols in the 13th century(?) within a generation, the Mongols had been converted. Again, to the mind of the muslim, this presented more proof that Allah had a direct influence on providing the faith with powerful guardians. Even as the whole of Islam splintered, into Arab, Persian, Turk kingdoms, there was still the belief that Muslims would one day control mosat of the world.

What many ME scholars present as the "Crisis of Islam" - in the 20th century, it became clear that the Muslim power could not compete with the industrialized west. In fact, the growth of modern media presented this reality to the man on the street, not only the rulers in Istanbul, Tehran and Cairo. This created the appeal of the extremist: "We have lost our way, and the only way to prove ourselves to Allah is to fight...." Much like the statement of Falwell after 9-11.

It's funny, theists claim to love god, and preach the all importance of the eternal soul....yet so many are obsessed with life and power here on earth.
swingout is offline  
Old 01-25-2002, 03:15 AM   #15
Regular Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 216
Post

Context in the Qur'an is a hard thing to come by. For the most part, the Qur'an doesn't even have a context. (Hence the reason Qur'anic contridictions aren't like Bible contradictions, which have a clear contextual basis.)

There's no definite locations given, it's not written in any sense of a chronological order, and there's little dates or times. That's the reason why we have the "Hadith", (somewhat spurious documents detailing what Muhammad and his followers did and said at purported locations.) In most cases, the Hadith appear to be little more than an elaboration on a text, (something like Christian commentary on a scripture), except that these claim to be from eyewitnesses accounts. Unfortunately, the earliest of these is 140 years post Muhammad, so what kind of eyewitnesses these were is debateable.

Anyway, history tells us that whenever Muhammad gained power in a region, he'd order his followers to destroy anyone else of that region who he didn't like. For instance, prior to the house of worship being the Kaaba in Mecca, Jersusalem was the old place where the Muslims would face to prostrate themselves before Allah. Later on, this was changed. Likewise, the "Satanic Verse", which Muhammad claimed to have received from Iblis, was in fact, his ideas when paganism was still prominate. The Satanic verse speak of the three Goddesses, or consorts, of Allah: Manat, Al-Lat, and Al-Uzza.

(Al-Lat is the crescent moon, a vulvic symbol, and Al-Uzza is the star on the Muslim flag.)

Anyway, Muhammad originally had a treaty with the Jews. After he gained power, he broke his treaty, expelled the Jews, and took over the area. There's even a great story in one of the Ahadith about the Jews being chased around in the "end days" by the Muslims, and a jew hides behind a tree. The Muslims walk up to the tree and ask him where the Jew is, and the tree won't tell them, (it's either a tree or a rock, can't remember). The tree is thus equated to being a cursed tree because it won't help the Muslims, follower of the creator "Allah". However, the story of Muslims chasing around unconverted Jews and killing them kind of shows the point of what the Arabians thought of the Jewish religion.

Likewise, he later said he had a demon possession once he was strong enough to get rid of the paganism in Arabia.
RyanS2 is offline  
 

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:43 AM.

Top

This custom BB emulates vBulletin® Version 3.8.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2015, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.