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Old 04-17-2002, 02:17 AM   #1
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Post Thanatos: Origins of Life

In the <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=000616&p=" target="_blank">Big Bang</a> thread, Thanatos posted thus:

Quote:
Originally posted by Thanatos:

<strong>You </strong>[Mageth, I think] <strong>stated that you don't yet understand exactly how abiogenesis occurred. Believing in something that you don't understand is the very definition of faith! </strong>
Which dictionary are you using? Faith is belief in the absence of evidence, not absence of understanding. Plenty of people claim to have some understanding of god and its will. Does this mean they do not have faith in it?

Quote:
<strong>You also stated that just because you didn't understand exactly how abiogenisis occurred doesn't mean that it didn't occur. This is true, however - on the other side of the coin - just because you theorize the occurrence of abiogenisis does not mean that it occurred. </strong>
But it is most parsimonious to assume it was not supernatural in origin. Hence the many good testable hypotheses about it that are being worked on right now. Have a browse round these for starters:

<a href="http://www.resa.net/nasa/origins_life.htm" target="_blank">NASA’s Origins of Life site</a>

<a href="http://www.accessexcellence.org/WN/SUA03/RNA_origins_life.html" target="_blank">RNA and the Origins of Life</a>

<a href="http://www.gla.ac.uk/projects/originoflife/html/2001/menu.htm" target="_blank">Origins of Life (University of Glasgow)</a>

<a href="http://www.origins.rpi.edu/chem.html#rna" target="_blank">Formation of the RNA World</a>

<a href="http://www.syslab.ceu.hu/corliss/Nature.html" target="_blank">The Emergence of Living Systems
in Archaean Submarine Hot Springs</a>

<a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?db=PubMed&cmd=Display&dopt=pubmed_pubme d&from_uid=11539076" target="_blank">Here’s 130 PubMed articles</a>.

And these two are interesting too:

<a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=115394 67&dopt=Abstract" target="_blank">Hydrogen cyanide polymerization</a>

<a href="http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?cmd=Retrieve&db=PubMed&list_uids=115413 37&dopt=Abstract" target="_blank">Hydrogen cyanide polymers</a>

Quote:
<strong>Food for thought</strong>
For the intellectually malnourished.

Quote:
<strong> - What is the minimum number of parts necessary for an autotrophic free living organism to live, and could these parts assemble by naturalistic means? </strong>
Is ‘Thanatos’ short for Cephalothanatos, by any chance? Or are you merely in the grip of your twin brother Hypnos? Time to wake up to reality. Autotrophic, eh? My, that’s a big word for one who knows so little about it. Define ‘organism’, old chap. Simply by being so complex, you are right, even the simplest organism is too unlikely to happen by chance. Hence nobody except creationists think that’s what science proposes. The origins of life are in chains of carbon atoms, not things as complex as ‘organisms’. See the links above.

Quote:
<strong>Rather than asking how life came from matter, I should have asked - how does life come from a non-living thing? </strong>
Good question. Define what you think 'life' is, and we'll try to answer.

Oolon
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Old 04-20-2002, 01:55 AM   #2
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