Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Calzaer · 08-12-2003, 11:44 AM

If at some point during the day my bad knee begins to hurt, for no apparent reason, it's probably going to rain today.

I've noticed many times when this hypothesis has been correct, and only a couple of times when it wasn't*. It's actually gotten to the point such that I rely on my aching knee more than the newspaper weather report. Further, other people with past joint injuries (and people with arthritis) report that changes in the weather are foreshadowed by increased pain in the injured joint.

What's up with this? Is this just some sort of weird psychosomatic effect accompanied by confirmation bias? Or is there some property of injured joints that causes them to ache more in the presence of... what? Humidity? Air pressure changes? Help me out here, folks.

-----
Footnote:

*I will admit to many times where there was rain without the preceeding knee ache. P implies Q, but Q does not imply P (or Knee implies Rain, but Rain does not imply Knee).

Nuno Figueira · 08-12-2003, 01:48 PM

I have this too. To my knowledge it happens when the humidity levels raise above a certain point.

tribalbeeyatch · 08-12-2003, 01:54 PM

Your joints are responding to changes in barometric pressure.

Calzaer · 08-12-2003, 03:37 PM

So is it humidity or barometric pressure?

08-12-2003, 03:53 PM

Barometric pressure, but I don't think there's any hard scientific evidence to support this. It could also be that you just feel better when the weather is nice.

tribalbeeyatch · 08-12-2003, 04:04 PM

Here's a relevant study:

Quote:

Ann Rheum Dis. 1990 Mar;49(3):158-9.

Effect of weather conditions on rheumatic patients.

Guedj D, Weinberger A.

Rheumatology Unit, Beilinson Medical Center, Petah Tikva, Israel.

In a one month prospective study of 62 rheumatic patients--16 with rheumatoid arthritis (RA), 24 with osteoarthritis (OA), 11 with inflammatory arthritis, 11 with fibromyalgia joint pain--swelling and everyday activity was compared with changes in daily weather conditions. In most patients weather changes increased arthritic symptoms. Women were more sensitive to weather than men (62% v 37%). Pain was affected positively by barometric pressure and temperature in RA, by temperature, rain, and barometric pressure in OA, and by barometric pressure in fibromyalgia. These results support the belief of most rheumatic patients that weather conditions significantly influence their day to day symptoms.

So apparently it isn't as simple as just barometric pressure. Depending upon the particular joint disorder, temperature and rain (humidity?) can also be factors.

ebolamonger · 08-13-2003, 09:59 AM

i have a bad scar on my left shin that used to ache before and during thunderstorms. It has healed up a little more and it only occasionally hurts when it rains now. I've always wondered--is scar tissue affected in the same way as the joints of people with rheumatism? Sometimes my leg would hurt so bad I could barely support weight on it.

Ardon28 · 08-13-2003, 03:57 PM

My theory is that lowered barometric pressure allows tissues to expand, and cause pain. When pressure is high, it's almost like wearing a natural compression bandage. So I don't think it's any change in pressure, I think it's only negative pressure gradients.

tribalbeeyatch · 08-13-2003, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ardon28
My theory is that lowered barometric pressure allows tissues to expand, and cause pain. When pressure is high, it's almost like wearing a natural compression bandage. So I don't think it's any change in pressure, I think it's only negative pressure gradients.

That's essentially my intuition as well. If changes in humidity or temperature lead to a similar expansion of tissues (maybe through a temporary homeostatic disequilibrium?), then they might contribute to joint pain in the same manner. I can't dig up any evidence for this conjecture (or much research on weather's contribution to joint pain at all), but it sounds like a reasonable explanation.

fried beef sandwich · 08-14-2003, 11:49 AM

Does it (barometric pressure) have something to do with the nitrogen gas in your joints? I heard somewhere that cracking your knuckles was basically releasing trapped N2 gas from your joints...

08-12-2003, 11:44 AM	#1
Calzaer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,762	Joint injuries and weather prediction If at some point during the day my bad knee begins to hurt, for no apparent reason, it's probably going to rain today. I've noticed many times when this hypothesis has been correct, and only a couple of times when it wasn't. It's actually gotten to the point such that I rely on my aching knee more than the newspaper weather report. Further, other people with past joint injuries (and people with arthritis) report that changes in the weather are foreshadowed by increased pain in the injured joint. What's up with this? Is this just some sort of weird psychosomatic effect accompanied by confirmation bias? Or is there some property of injured joints that causes them to ache more in the presence of... what? Humidity? Air pressure changes? Help me out here, folks. ----- Footnote: I will admit to many times where there was rain without the preceeding knee ache. P implies Q, but Q does not imply P (or Knee implies Rain, but Rain does not imply Knee).

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08-12-2003, 01:48 PM	#2
Nuno Figueira Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Portugal Posts: 92	I have this too. To my knowledge it happens when the humidity levels raise above a certain point.

08-12-2003, 01:54 PM	#3
tribalbeeyatch Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: On the edge Posts: 509	Your joints are responding to changes in barometric pressure.

08-12-2003, 03:37 PM	#4
Calzaer Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Ohio Posts: 2,762	So is it humidity or barometric pressure?

08-12-2003, 03:53 PM	#5
FloatingEgg Guest Posts: n/a	Barometric pressure, but I don't think there's any hard scientific evidence to support this. It could also be that you just feel better when the weather is nice.

08-13-2003, 09:59 AM	#7
ebolamonger Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: San Francisco, CA, USA Posts: 685	i have a bad scar on my left shin that used to ache before and during thunderstorms. It has healed up a little more and it only occasionally hurts when it rains now. I've always wondered--is scar tissue affected in the same way as the joints of people with rheumatism? Sometimes my leg would hurt so bad I could barely support weight on it.

08-13-2003, 03:57 PM	#8
Ardon28 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Hummelstown,PA Posts: 17	My theory is that lowered barometric pressure allows tissues to expand, and cause pain. When pressure is high, it's almost like wearing a natural compression bandage. So I don't think it's any change in pressure, I think it's only negative pressure gradients.

08-14-2003, 11:49 AM	#10
fried beef sandwich Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 1,156	Does it (barometric pressure) have something to do with the nitrogen gas in your joints? I heard somewhere that cracking your knuckles was basically releasing trapped N2 gas from your joints...

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