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11-14-2002, 10:37 AM | #71 |
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I think the analogy works better if you use a sphere rather than a cylinder, since a sphere does not have edges - on a cylinder, there will be a central line.
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11-15-2002, 08:07 AM | #72 |
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We can take the cylinder and fold it over to make a torus shape, which is just as good. It's too hard to make a sphere out of paper, isn't it?
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11-15-2002, 12:05 PM | #73 |
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Actually, it's pretty hard to make a decent torus out a single piece of paper too. Still, I see your point.
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11-15-2002, 09:02 PM | #74 | |
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11-16-2002, 07:08 AM | #75 |
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Don't mean to jump into the middle of an arguement, but most of you seem informed enough to answer my question: I have heard (sceince channel and whatnot; bad sources I know...) that nde's have happened in all cultures, and often reflect the mainstream beliefs of that culture, although not necessarily that of the person. For example, an atheist in Geaorgia, USA might experience a bright light and tunnel to a heaven-like place. I'm aware there are cases where peopl simply have out-od-body experiences, but I'm interested in whether or not they can be attricuted to societies influence on views of the afterlife.
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11-16-2002, 09:56 AM | #76 |
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Yes, they can and do. I've read of some Hindu NDE's, that do not look anything at all like those in the West. It seems the only thing common for all cultures, is the feeling of peace and the light. The message is always different. A new ager and fundementalist both will claim to have met God, but apparently this deity of the afterlife suffers from multiple personality disorder.
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11-16-2002, 09:57 AM | #77 | |
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11-16-2002, 12:21 PM | #78 |
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I think NDEs are more of and obsession with the new age movement that any think else and became very popular especially after <a href="http://skepdic.com/moody.html" target="_blank">Raymond Moody</a> published his book "Life after Life."
I treat the NDEs as some kind of a red herring that is no evidence of a window into the afterworld. New Agers frequently claim they see all their dead relatives, Adult Christians may commonly claim to contact with religious figures like God, Angels, the Virgin Mary, or Jesus, but children with no religious indoctrination may meet people that have not died like close relatives or they report being united the fictional characters like the the Telly Tubbys or Thamas the Tank Engine and Friends. Hardy the classical image of Heaven The "starving brain" theory I feel is the best explanation such as depriving the brain of oxygen or anoxia. [ November 16, 2002: Message edited by: crocodile deathroll ]</p> |
11-16-2002, 03:49 PM | #79 | ||
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According to Susan Blackmore's article <a href="http://www.susanblackmore.co.uk/si91nde.html" target="_blank">Near-Death Experiences: In or out of the body? Skeptical Inquirer 1991, 16, 34-45</a>: Quote:
Blackmore, S. J., and T. S. Troscianko. 1989. The physiology of the tunnel. Journal of Near-Death Studies, 8:15-28. Clearly though there are culture-, person- and situation-specific aspects of NDEs though. For instance, although 'the light' is not culture-specific, it occurs much more commonly in cases involving cardiac arrest and anesthesia. Appearance of people or spirits or gods is fairly rare, and what is 'seen' is very variable. For instance, some have reported a female figure, some a male figure, some children have reported cats and dogs, and one Indian account of a 7 foot tall chicken. Dead relatives are the most common in adults, although as was already pointed out, children are more likely to see living friends or relatives than ones who have died (Morse, J., P. Castillo, D. Venecia, J. Milstein, and D. C. Tyler. 1986. Childhood near-death experiences. American Journal of Diseases of Children, 140:1110-1114). |
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11-16-2002, 09:07 PM | #80 |
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Comparing NDEs to death itself is like comparing a bunge jump to a suicide leap off a cliff.
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