Corso

It is my contention that most Christians really don’t believe in Free Will. They say they do, but they also expect him interfere in man’s affairs whenever possible. I will provide an example of this paradox.

Carl shoots his neighbor, Steve. At the hospital Steve’s family prays for his survival. God hears their prayers and instantly heals Steve of all his wounds. Now, this means Carl’s objective ( killing Steve) has been thwarted. It would appear that God has revoked Carl’s free will. If this is true, wouldn’t it make The FWD invalid? I certainly think so. But of course Christians want to have their cake and eat it to.

Darth Dane

To answer this we must use scripture. "ask and you shall be given".

Carl asked God for Steve to die. Carl God the message that it will happen faster if he shoots him. So thats what Carl does.

The family asks(prays) that Steve should survive, and because more people where asking for teh same thing, that happened. "ask and you shall be given" The louder you ask, or the more asks for the same thing, the more powerful the request to God.

Think the shepherd that left the 99 sheep, for the one fat one, themost prized. The bigger teh voice, the more likely you are to get what you want.


But what do you want and how do you want it? Through others suffering?

Freewil reigns supreme






DD - Love Spliff

Corso

BUMP

oriecat

Here are my thoughts on your problem as posed.

I don't think that Carl's free will was violated. He used his free will to shoot Steve. But Carl does not have the power to decide whether Steve lives or dies from that shooting. If he really wanted him dead, he should have used his free will to shoot him a couple more times for good measure.

However, I do think that Steve's free will was violated. He did not get to decide what would happen to him. He was not given a choice of living or dying. That was taken away from him and the will of god and those praying people was pressed onto him. Of course then they might say that Steve was unconscious and unable to make his choice known to anyone, however god being god knows what Steve would choose and therefore healed Steve in accordance with Steve's choice and not the prayers of the others, therefore actually helping Steve's free will.

Seraphim

Carl shoots his neighbor, Steve. At the hospital Steve’s family prays for his survival. God hears their prayers and instantly heals Steve of all his wounds. Now, this means Carl’s objective ( killing Steve) has been thwarted. It would appear that God has revoked Carl’s free will.

My reply : This is a very bad analog for free will. You have seems to have forgotten that BOTH Carl and Steve has free will.

Did Steve allowed Carl to shoot him?

If He did allow Carl to shoot Steve and God allowed Steve to die, then had He taken away Steve's free will to live and die by allowing Carl to form his action?

By allowing Steve to live, then did He taken away Carl's free will to shoot another person?

Like I said, this is a VERY bad analog for free will.