Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Secular Pinoy · 08-01-2003, 02:13 AM

I use Textpad to get started, and 1st Page 2000 or CSE HTML Validator to tweak it. I would be interested in using a WYSIWYG editor, but I don't have the software. I used Dreamweaver, but I find it cumbersome. I tried Microsoft Word 2000, but I ended up with one of the worst and most bloated webpage code ever.

chanoc · 08-01-2003, 07:32 AM

>>>if condition "shit, I don't what to code!!!!"
then, "fucking study a book!"
Check this code, it's CSS, HTML, and JavaScript, not quite DHTML, but whatever....
<html>
<head>
<style type="text/css">
body
{background: white;}
.left { text-align: left; }
.center { text-align: center; }
.right { text-align: right;}

a:link {
color: red;
text-decoration: underline; }
#content {
position: relative;
font-family: arial,helvetica,
geneva,sans-serif; }

h1 {
font:small-caps bold italic 2.5em
'minion web' Georgia, 'Times
New Roman', Times, serif;
color: red; }

h2 {
font: bold 1.5em 'minion web'
Georgia, 'Times New Roman',
Times, serif;
font-size; 1.5em }

.dropcap {
font: 300%/100% serif;
color: #999999;
margin-right: -3px; }
</style>
</head>
<body>
<center><table bgcolor="#000000" width="90%" border="0"><tr><td>

<script language="JavaScript">
</script>
</tr>
</td>
</table>

<div id="content">
<br>
<h1 class="center">Truckin' Sessions</h1>
<h2 class="center">Dale Watson</h2>
<p style="style: italic; font-family:
monospace;" class="center">Honky Tonk Texas Country!</p>
<h3 class="left">An excellent CD
<br>by Dale Watson</h3>
<p class="left"><span class="dropcap">D</span>ale Watson's Truckin' Sessions features 14 tracks of pure Country Outlaw! The CD is in excellent condition, and has only been played once, copied to my hard drive. The CD features:</p>
<img src="http://www.dalewatson.com/images/truckin.gif" align="right">
<table>
<tr>
<td><h1 class="left"> Track Listings </h1>
<br><h2 class="center">The Truckin' Sessions<h2>

<br>1. Good Luck 'N' Good Truckin' Tonite

_
_

<br>2. _Big Wheels Keep Rollin'

<br>3. Heaven In Baltimore

_
_

<br>4. Have Your Got It On

_
_

<br>5. _Makin' Up Time
_

<br>6. Flat Tire

_
_

<br>7. _Drag Along & Tag Along
_

<br>8. Exit 109
_
_

<br>9. Help Me Joe
_
_

<br>10. _...Loose Nut Behind The Wheel

_

<br>11. You've Got A Long Way To Go

_
_

<br>12. _Longhorn Suburban

<br>13. _I'm Fixin To Have Me A Breakdown
_

<br>14. I Gotta Get Home To My Baby
<br>
<br>
<table align="center" border="1" cellpadding="1">
<tr>
<td><b><span class="dropcap">H</span>ello, my name is Chad Tudor, and I am a reseller of computer hareware/software, CDs, and DVDs. Email [email protected] with any questions.</font></b>
<h1 class="center">Shipping:</h1>
<ul>
<li><b>USPS First-Class Mail</b>: $3.00</li>
<li><b>USPS Priority Mail</b>: $5.00</li>
<li><b>Canada</b>: $5.00</li>
<li><b>UK</b>: $6.00</li>
<li> <b> Slightly more for other international orders. Email me for rates.</b>.</li>
<h2 class="center">Thank you for looking, and happy bidding!</font></h2>
</tr>
</td>
</table>
</div>
</body>
</html>

lowmagnet · 08-01-2003, 08:32 AM

I ALWAYS generate xHTML 1.1 strict. It's very easy when your content is converted from XML to a xHTML stream. There is something satisfying about getting rid of style markup in your document. It becomes so much easier to read. That, and anyone can read your site with any browser, including cellphones

Guillaume · 08-01-2003, 09:10 AM

What is the point of using HTML instead of Dreamweaver ? I mean typing HTML seems like a big waste of time to me. Plus you can't see in real time how your page looks.

DarkBronzePlant · 08-01-2003, 09:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Guillaume
What is the point of using HTML instead of Dreamweaver ? I mean typing HTML seems like a big waste of time to me. Plus you can't see in real time how your page looks.

Well, for one, if you're using Dreamweaver, then you are also "using" HTML; Dreamweaver generates HTML.

But more to the point, there are multiple ways to use HTML to acheive approximately the same result. Dreamweaver (and GoLive, etc) produces HTML in a manner that it thinks you want it to behave. If you are a skilled HTML developer, you can produce HTML that behaves exactly as you intend it to, and--furthermore--in all of the browsers that want to target.

Finally, it's often easier to hand-code when a lot of your HTML is generated on the fly. I know Dreamweaver can handle JSPs, ASPs and PHP pages, but to me it's still easier to, for example, hand-code a small bit of HTML that might be iterated over, than it is to create it in a drag-n-drop manner. Plus, often it's far more trouble than it is worth to FTP files back and forth, and fire up Dreamweaver to make minor changes.

Actually, my question is "Why go through the trouble of purchasing and installing Dreamweaver, then firing it up every time you need to edit and HTML page, when you could just ssh into the server, use vi (pico, whatever) to make a quick change and be done with it?"

fando · 08-01-2003, 11:01 AM

I've always done HTML/XML/*ML by hand, usually out of necessity. When you write programs that generate HTML, that HTML is either templated out or must be hard coded into the program. Even when it's templated, it usually falls to the programmer to write the templates themselves. Anyways, I kind of wish they chose something easier to type than the angle brackets though. After many years, I've settled on vi as the penultimate HTML/XML editor. Colored syntax highlighting, highly programmable macros and automatic indentation is a dream for writing structured content.

Quote:

Originally posted by Corona688
But really... vi is a *HORRIBLE* editor. It's bad bad bad. I've taught myself to use it several times; it never sticks. Just too alien.

Hey, vi is not everybody's cup of tea, especially if one is not a programmer. Many can't get used to the dual mode nature of vi, but that's no reason to pan it outright. The reason for how it is has to do with saving keystrokes and boy does it save over emacs. I used to get horrible pinky cramps from constantly reaching for the CTRL key (as programmers have to do all the damn time). Pico (and nano) are crap for structured texts but great for email.

lowmagnet · 08-01-2003, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by fando
I used to get horrible pinky cramps from constantly reaching for the CTRL key (as programmers have to do all the damn time).

Most EMACS users I know re-map their keyboards to a Sun-Style layout. Ctrl is right off one's left pinky, and caps lock takes the normal Ctrl location in the corner.

My keyboard has ctrl, alt, home, end, delete, Back Space, Page Up, Page Down, Enter, and Space directly under my two thumbs. I never have to worry about this anymore.

The only problem I have with vi and my keyboard is that some vi shortcuts are spatial in QWERTY, and I type in Dvorak.

View Poll Results: Do you code the HTML manually or do you use a WYSIWYG editor?
I always code the HTML manually	47	65.28%
I always use a WYSIWYG editor	1	1.39%
I use a WYSIWYG editor and then manually correct its HTML output	15	20.83%
I code the HTML manually for some sites, and use a WYSIWYG editor for others	9	12.50%
Voters: 72. You may not vote on this poll

08-01-2003, 07:32 AM	#42
chanoc Banned Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Auke Bay, Alaska Posts: 422	This is How I CODE!!! >>>if condition "shit, I don't what to code!!!!" then, "fucking study a book!" Check this code, it's CSS, HTML, and JavaScript, not quite DHTML, but whatever.... <html> <head> <style type="text/css"> body {background: white;} .left { text-align: left; } .center { text-align: center; } .right { text-align: right;} <!--FUCK THEM IF THEY DONT LiKE RED--> a:link { color: red; text-decoration: underline; } #content { position: relative; font-family: arial,helvetica, geneva,sans-serif; } h1 { font:small-caps bold italic 2.5em 'minion web' Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; color: red; } h2 { font: bold 1.5em 'minion web' Georgia, 'Times New Roman', Times, serif; font-size; 1.5em } .dropcap { font: 300%/100% serif; color: #999999; margin-right: -3px; } </style> </head> <body> <center><table bgcolor="#000000" width="90%" border="0"><tr><td> <script language="JavaScript"><!-- line=new Object() line[1]="My CDs are good quality!" line[2]="I ship fast!" line[3]="I will respond to your emails!" line[4]="Check my feedback!" line[5]="Good luck bidding!" line[6]="I offer the best value!" line[7]="Buy with confidence!" lines=7 //--Number of lines //--Don't edit below this line document.write('<form name="bannerform">') document.write('<div align="center"><center><p><input type="text" name="banner" size="36"') document.write(' style="background-color: #000000; color: #FFFFFF; text-align: center; font-family: verdana; font-size: 24pt; border: medium none" onfocus="blur()"></p>') document.write(' </center></div>') document.write('</form>') temp="" nextchar=-1; nextline=1; cursor="\\" function animate(){ if (temp==line[nextline] & temp.length==line[nextline].length & nextline!=lines){ nextline++; nextchar=-1; document.bannerform.banner.value=temp; temp=""; setTimeout("nextstep()",1000)} else if (nextline==lines & temp==line[nextline] & temp.length==line[nextline].length){ nextline=1; nextchar=-1; document.bannerform.banner.value=temp; temp=""; setTimeout("nextstep()",1000)} else{ nextstep()}} function nextstep(){ if (cursor=="\\"){ cursor="\|"} else if (cursor=="\|"){ cursor="/"} else if (cursor=="/"){ cursor="-"} else if (cursor=="-"){ cursor="\\"} nextchar++; temp+=line[nextline].charAt(nextchar); document.bannerform.banner.value=temp+cursor setTimeout("animate()",25)} document.onload=animate(); // --> </script> </tr> </td> </table> <div id="content"> <br> <h1 class="center">Truckin' Sessions</h1> <h2 class="center">Dale Watson</h2> <p style="style: italic; font-family: monospace;" class="center">Honky Tonk Texas Country!</p> <h3 class="left">An excellent CD <br>by Dale Watson</h3> <p class="left"><span class="dropcap">D</span>ale Watson's Truckin' Sessions features 14 tracks of pure Country Outlaw! The CD is in excellent condition, and has only been played once, copied to my hard drive. The CD features:</p> <img src="http://www.dalewatson.com/images/truckin.gif" align="right"> <table> <tr> <td><h1 class="left"> Track Listings </h1> <br><h2 class="center">The Truckin' Sessions<h2> <br>1. Good Luck 'N' Good Truckin' Tonite _ _ <br>2. _Big Wheels Keep Rollin' <br>3. Heaven In Baltimore _ _ <br>4. Have Your Got It On _ _ <br>5. _Makin' Up Time _ <br>6. Flat Tire _ _ <br>7. _Drag Along & Tag Along _ <br>8. Exit 109 _ _ <br>9. Help Me Joe _ _ <br>10. _...Loose Nut Behind The Wheel _ <br>11. You've Got A Long Way To Go _ _ <br>12. _Longhorn Suburban <br>13. _I'm Fixin To Have Me A Breakdown _ <br>14. I Gotta Get Home To My Baby <br> <br> <table align="center" border="1" cellpadding="1"> <tr> <td><b><span class="dropcap">H</span>ello, my name is Chad Tudor, and I am a reseller of computer hareware/software, CDs, and DVDs. Email [email protected] with any questions.</font></b> <h1 class="center">Shipping:</h1> <ul> <li><b>USPS First-Class Mail</b>: $3.00</li> <li><b>USPS Priority Mail</b>: $5.00</li> <li><b>Canada</b>: $5.00</li> <li><b>UK</b>: $6.00</li> <li> <b> Slightly more for other international orders. Email me for rates.</b>.</li> <h2 class="center">Thank you for looking, and happy bidding!</font></h2> </tr> </td> </table> </div> </body> </html>

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08-01-2003, 02:13 AM	#41
Secular Pinoy Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2001 Location: Quezon City, Philippines Posts: 1,994	I use Textpad to get started, and 1st Page 2000 or CSE HTML Validator to tweak it. I would be interested in using a WYSIWYG editor, but I don't have the software. I used Dreamweaver, but I find it cumbersome. I tried Microsoft Word 2000, but I ended up with one of the worst and most bloated webpage code ever.

08-01-2003, 08:32 AM	#43
lowmagnet Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2000 Location: North Raleigh, NC Posts: 959	I ALWAYS generate xHTML 1.1 strict. It's very easy when your content is converted from XML to a xHTML stream. There is something satisfying about getting rid of style markup in your document. It becomes so much easier to read. That, and anyone can read your site with any browser, including cellphones

08-01-2003, 09:10 AM	#44
Guillaume Regular Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: Canada, Québec Posts: 285	What is the point of using HTML instead of Dreamweaver ? I mean typing HTML seems like a big waste of time to me. Plus you can't see in real time how your page looks.

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