Freethought & Rationalism Archive

FrankQ · 11-01-2002, 12:45 PM

I am in a discussion, in another forum, with a physicist who claims the 2nd Law of thermodynamics is incompatible with evolution.

He throws equations at me which go beyond my exertise. What is the strongest argument I can use to show that evolution and the 2nd Law are not incompatible?

Mageth · 11-01-2002, 12:49 PM

Are you sure he/she is a physicist?

Here's a link to <a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/thermo.html" target="_blank">talkorigins</a> that should give you quite a bit of ammo.

KC · 11-01-2002, 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FrankQ:
I am in a discussion, in another forum, with a physicist who claims the 2nd Law of thermodynamics is incompatible with evolution.

He throws equations at me which go beyond my exertise. What is the strongest argument I can use to show that evolution and the 2nd Law are not incompatible?

Any physicist worth a damn should be able to discuss SLOT with a minimum of equations. My guess is you're dealing with an imposter. The talk.origin links provided by the other poster should sort him out nicely.

Cheers,

KC

Cheers,

JonF · 11-01-2002, 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by FrankQ:
I am in a discussion, in another forum, with a physicist who claims the 2nd Law of thermodynamics is incompatible with evolution.

He throws equations at me which go beyond my exertise. What is the strongest argument I can use to show that evolution and the 2nd Law are not incompatible?

<a href="http://www.2ndlaw.com/evolution.html" target="_blank">The second law of thermodynamics and evolution</a> is an excellent page in itself, with links to several other useful pages (especially at the end). The whole site and its sister site, <a href="http://www.secondlaw.com/" target="_blank">The Second Law of Thermodynamics</a>, are chock-full of good info on the 2LoT.

See also <a href="http://members.aol.com/steamdoc/writings/thermo.html" target="_blank">The Second Law of Thermodynamics
in the Context of the Christian Faith</a>.

Jesus Tap-Dancin' Christ · 11-01-2002, 01:38 PM

He's full of shit. Ask ANY OTHER PHYSICIST!! Even ones that disagree with evolution will state that the 2nd law is a bullshit argument.

wdog · 11-01-2002, 03:22 PM

Frank,

check out the thread right below this one

<a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=001610" target="_blank">http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=001610</a>

also ask him to state the second law for open macroscopic thermodynamic systems (check out any book on classical thermo, or come back here for the answer) like the human body. I'll bet he screws it up. then ask him what the 2nd law is for the genome, I'll bet he scews that up too.

If he wants to argue from the authority of being a physicist, tell him that physicist Ilya Prigogine, who won the nobel prize for his work in statistical mechanics (of which thermodynics is a part), disagrees with him.

Steven S · 11-01-2002, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Jesus Christ:
He's full of shit. Ask ANY OTHER PHYSICIST!!

I'm a physicist and I say he's full of shit.

Steven S

enigma555 · 11-01-2002, 08:00 PM

Ask him to expand what he says.

If Evolution violates the 2LoT by having subsequent generations growing into more complex beings, have him explain how a baby can form from a single cell without violating 2LoT.

Post the link to the thread. I love ripping apart halfwits who think they're scientists.

[ November 01, 2002: Message edited by: enigma555 ]

11-01-2002, 12:45 PM	#1
FrankQ Junior Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 5	2nd Law I am in a discussion, in another forum, with a physicist who claims the 2nd Law of thermodynamics is incompatible with evolution. He throws equations at me which go beyond my exertise. What is the strongest argument I can use to show that evolution and the 2nd Law are not incompatible?

11-01-2002, 08:00 PM	#8
enigma555 Regular Member Join Date: May 2002 Location: Washington, DC Posts: 282	Ask him to expand what he says. If Evolution violates the 2LoT by having subsequent generations growing into more complex beings, have him explain how a baby can form from a single cell without violating 2LoT. Post the link to the thread. I love ripping apart halfwits who think they're scientists. [ November 01, 2002: Message edited by: enigma555 ]</p>

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11-01-2002, 12:49 PM	#2
Mageth Contributor Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Deep in the heart of mother-lovin' Texas Posts: 29,689	Are you sure he/she is a physicist? Here's a link to <a href="http://www.talkorigins.org/faqs/thermo.html" target="_blank">talkorigins</a> that should give you quite a bit of ammo.

11-01-2002, 01:38 PM	#5
Jesus Tap-Dancin' Christ Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Heaven Posts: 6,980	He's full of shit. Ask ANY OTHER PHYSICIST!! Even ones that disagree with evolution will state that the 2nd law is a bullshit argument.

11-01-2002, 03:22 PM	#6
wdog Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Ohio, USA Posts: 1,547	Frank, check out the thread right below this one <a href="http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=001610" target="_blank">http://iidb.org/cgi-bin/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=58&t=001610</a> also ask him to state the second law for open macroscopic thermodynamic systems (check out any book on classical thermo, or come back here for the answer) like the human body. I'll bet he screws it up. then ask him what the 2nd law is for the genome, I'll bet he scews that up too. If he wants to argue from the authority of being a physicist, tell him that physicist Ilya Prigogine, who won the nobel prize for his work in statistical mechanics (of which thermodynics is a part), disagrees with him.

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