Yellum Notnef

100 mystics?
Start naming them.

They will laugh for a thousand years? Why not two thousand years? why not a million years?
You're just making up this nonsense as you go along.

I await your excuses for not answering my questions.

Birdsmgp

... I have been thinking about this for awhile. But Bordom is usually still at something with fatigue coming on us. I see so many people once they have rested and regained some energy for seeing another day, that they are back doing many things that got them bored previousely. Sometimes there is reminiscent, and you hear of people wanting to do things they used to do before. So I see Bordom only lasting for something in its duration of that time and moment. If a trillion things are done and it's been a trillion cycles since something hasn't been done, then a little forgetfulness or reminiscence and replenished of energy, the idea of reputition to something, might not be as bad as having to go to work every 5 or so days out of the week, as we do now? I'm not saying there is a "God" in all this. I almost think that we are the first creation in this universe. We ourselves might be something we haven't even thought of? I only think as much as the universe is, that it just is making new and expanding. I do like the idea of having eternal life. At the same time, I don't like fooling myself among ourselves with fantasies and fiction either. I like to see what is real and hope what is real will be real. The point of being an Atheist. For some Atheist that doesn't seem to have that imagitive mind, is actually something in a sense?: You might also find that most Fiction writers are Atheist, having some of the greatest imaginations. It is the matter of seperating Fiction from Facts. So the idea to think that the Facts of the imagination that we will do these things for eternity is harder to believe as facts, then to have un-factual imaginations that we will never see happen as a real thing or experience for us as a real occurance to expect.

Grad Student Humanist

Everyone's talking about imagination now, and how they can construct a Heaven consisting of activities that would keep them entertained for eternity.

Well if Heaven does exist it's not going to be like a giant Holodeck fantasy. You don't get to decide on the activities or the decor. God will set the rules, and I don't think he's going to let people live out a bunch of sexual fantasies, or adventure stories, or any other crazy schemes. I'm sure a Heaven which is full of fundies and other religionists isn't going to have the human amenities which make life on earth bearable.

Many people scoff at the Muslim heaven since it seems like immature wish fulfillment; but I would much rather go to that Heaven than to the Xtian one where people hang out all day telling God how good he is.

philechat

Although it is true that without the possibility of failing certain tasks, or the possibility of an activity being somewhat dangerous and requiring caution, or activities that actually involved a great deal of suffering in men's part (such as sports), this Heaven can indeed become boring after a short while. Who doesn't want to bet on their lives with several choices just to feel its exhilirations (all ski bums know this)? Who doesn't feel joy to be accepted by the person he loves because it is possible that he failed? Who doesn't feel the joy of creativity because it might come out as crap? For these alone the popular notion of Heaven is driving me banging my head against the wall. What stupidity this heaven must be if we were not challenged with the possiblity of being screwed up (or even end up dead) once in a while?

No wonder the Norse heaven also had its appeal. For the Norse warriors, heaven is a place where he can fight the strongest and most dangerous monsters. This is the heaven that appealed to the ancient Norse, not the suger-plum fairy heaven dreamed up by the Christians.

Birdsmgp

... I guess we all have our ideas of what we like Heaven to be like? ... ... philechat?



... I still kind of like it like this though...

philechat

ROFLMAO...

sullster

What a load on nonsense that theists think that their god will keep them busy and show them universes and other wild stuff. Give me break! The REAL UNIVERSE is amazing enough and has things going that we can discover for as long as humans are around.

Why can't religious types just grow up and accept personal exinction? Why continue to waste time dreaming about some imaginary state when there is a real and amazing reality all around you?

Chrisianity is so disgusting in its zeal to promote the nothingness of an imaginary eternity. Go outside and look around, there is an amazing real world out there! You aren't going to be around for long, so drink it in. STop sticking your minds in the sands of illusions!

Angrillori

Which brings me to my question: Why didn't god do this in the first place then? It sems like he found a way for us NOT TO BE ROBOTS but still NOT CHOOSE EVIL

What the heck?!?!? Is he really that big of a jerk? He knew the way to keep our free will AND get us all to heaven and simply CHOSE not to do it??? GWA?

But wait.

Adam and Eve. They knew god's love before sin. Yet they turned to sin. Why couldn't people in heaven do it too?

So. Either god's a total smeg-head OR there's sin in heaven, OR we're robots in heaven.

Gee. Great set of choices.

Angrillori

And yet, this world is the best plan he can come up with in the meantime.

I don't think you're talking about the same omnipotent guy that's in the bible dude. He's clearly not as creative as you make him out to be. His response to anything generally revolved around killing and torture.

I imagine the biblical god's answer to our boredom would be...surprise...kill us and send us to hell. Think about it. Adam and Eve eat fruit--kill and torture them. Angels fall away--kill and torture them. The Noahacian people turn away from god--kill 'em. The Caananites are in the Israelite space--kill 'em. And so on and so on.

And before you tell me that god promised eternal life, we already know god can and does often change his mind. (Anyone talk to Jonah lately?)

On another note of how lacking in knowledge of his own omnipotence God is, take this whole evil thing. He's already shown us he can't make us with free will and the ability to resist evil. Heck he's not so creative to me!

And let's see what we already know about how great heaven is and how we'll want to be there forever.
Heck, heaven wasn't even good enough for the angels to want to stay in!

Radorth

The trees, flowers and stars are nice, but of course we had nothing to do with creating those. We can't even make pond scum.

The part we created after obtaining "the knowledge of good and evil" is sick and disgusting, and headed for self-extinction. And I'm sure there will be plenty of Christians around to witness it.

Rad