Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Chip · 11-07-2002, 05:57 PM

Bovine growth hormone, hmmmm, more milk, more money, more cancer?

<a href="http://vvv.com/healthnews/milk.html" target="_blank">http://vvv.com/healthnews/milk.html</a>

Take care, Chip

Edited to fix graphics URL.

[ November 07, 2002: Message edited by: Chip ]

Corona688 · 11-07-2002, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chip:
more milk, more money, more cancer?

Not everything's a big conspiracy... they prolly thought it was a good idea at the time, and backpedalling hurts when it's been done for so long.

seesaw · 11-08-2002, 01:20 AM

Quote:

Not everything's a big conspiracy... they prolly thought it was a good idea at the time, and backpedalling hurts when it's been done for so long.

I agree, they just probably thought it was a good idea at the time.

MadMordigan · 11-08-2002, 11:59 PM

Be wary of ascribing to malice what can be explained by stupdity.

Chip · 11-09-2002, 06:20 AM

Take a look at the advertisements on your TV, in newspapers, in magazines, on radio. The vast majority of these present lies meant to get people to buy things based on misinformation. Conspiracy is very common and allowed.

Based on my own research of second-order cybernetics, the science of control systems as pertains to sociology, I came to the same conclusion as Lysander Spooner championed at the close of the US civil war. Nations, and most institutions, are basically fraudulent enterprises, conspiracies to preserve priveleges for a few at the expense of many, <a href="http://www.mind-trek.com/reports/cona.htm" target="_blank">http://www.mind-trek.com/reports/cona.htm</a>

Here's another URL regarding Bovine Growth Hormone <a href="http://www.organicconsumers.org/rbgh/akrepart1.cfm" target="_blank">http://www.organicconsumers.org/rbgh/akrepart1.cfm</a> If Monsanto just made a mistake that they find too painful to admit, then they are going to great pains to avoid that mistake becoming common knowledge.

Check out Monsanto's court sanctioned outrageousness proceeding in Canada regarding genetically modified corn <a href="http://www.percyschmeiser.com/" target="_blank">http://www.percyschmeiser.com/</a>

I know it is not a happy thought that conspiracy to take advantage of people's ignorance and trust appears widespread but there is intelligence in not disregarding this possibility when the evidence is so apparent.

Regards, Chip

Chip · 11-18-2002, 10:23 AM

BTW, my family uses Horizon brand dairy products which does not contain BVGH. Ben and Jerry have strongly voiced their opposition to BVGH and claim that they haven't and will not use such tainted milk in their ice cream products.

Regards, Chip

lisarea · 11-18-2002, 11:39 AM

Well, if I may gloat for a moment here, I simply chose from among the many local milk delivery companies a small, family run farm that pledges to never use BGH.

And they deliver it in thick glass bottles, too, with a slab of ice on top to keep it cold.

MortalWombat · 11-18-2002, 12:42 PM

You know, I took a look at that website, which states:

Quote:

Researchers at the FDA reported in 1990 that IGF-1 is not destroyed by pasteurization and that pasteurization actually increases its concentration in BST-milk. They also confirmed that undigested protein could indeed cross the intestinal wall in humans and cited tests which showed that oral ingestion of IGF-1 produced a significant increase in the growth of a group of male rats - a finding dismissed earlier by the Monsanto scientists(25). The most important aspect of these experiments is that they show that IGF-1 can indeed enter the blood stream from the intestines - at least in rats.

So I looked up reference 25 in PubMed, and this is the abstract:

Quote:

Science 1990 Aug 24;249(4971):875-84
Bovine growth hormone: human food safety evaluation.

Juskevich JC, Guyer CG.

Food and Drug Administration, Center for Veterinary Medicine, Office of New Animal Drug Evaluation, Rockville, MD 20857.

Scientists in the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), after reviewing the scientific literature and evaluating studies conducted by pharmaceutical companies, have concluded that the use of recombinant bovine growth hormone (rbGH) in dairy cattle presents no increased health risk to consumers. Bovine GH is not biologically active in humans, and oral toxicity studies have demonstrated that rbGH is not orally active in rats, a species responsive to parenterally administered bGH. Recombinant bGH treatment produces an increase in the concentration of insulin-like growth factor-I (IGF-I) in cow's milk. However, oral toxicity studies have shown that bovine IGF-I lacks oral activity in rats. Additionally, the concentration of IGF-I in milk of rbGH-treated cows is within the normal physiological range found in human breast milk, and IGF-I is denatured under conditions used to process cow's milk for infant formula. On the basis of estimates of the amount of protein absorbed intact in humans and the concentration of IGF-I in cow's milk during rbGH treatment, biologically significant levels of intact IGF-I would not be absorbed.

This Hans Larsen guy seems to be misrepresenting the findings in at least one of the articles that he cites.

Chip · 11-18-2002, 03:33 PM

"This Hans Larsen guy seems to be misrepresenting the findings in at least one of the articles that he cites."

Difficult to come to that conclusion from just an abstract.

Here are some other URLs some of which report information that appears to confirm the citation you have attempted to discredit.

<a href="http://www.home.intekom.com/tm_info/rw80626.htm#Monsanto�s" target="_blank">http://www.home.intekom.com/tm_info/rw80626.htm#Monsanto�s</a>
<a href="http://www.vegsource.com/articles/breast_cancer.htm" target="_blank">http://www.vegsource.com/articles/breast_cancer.htm</a>
<a href="http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/john.rose/rbgh.html" target="_blank">http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/john.rose/rbgh.html</a>
<a href="http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1527/rbghlink.html" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1527/rbghlink.html</a>
<a href="http://nofany.org/hottopics/bovinegrowthhormone.html" target="_blank">http://nofany.org/hottopics/bovinegrowthhormone.html</a>
<a href="http://www.parkc.org/GeneticEngCancer.htm" target="_blank">http://www.parkc.org/GeneticEngCancer.htm</a>
<a href="http://www.transnationale.org/anglais/sources/alimentation/hormones__rgbh_cancer_hazard.htm" target="_blank">http://www.transnationale.org/anglais/sources/alimentation/hormones__rgbh_cancer_hazard.htm</a>
<a href="http://www.foodsafetynow.org/info.asp?cam_id=57" target="_blank">http://www.foodsafetynow.org/info.asp?cam_id=57</a>
<a href="http://www.healthcoalition.ca/bgh.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.healthcoalition.ca/bgh.pdf</a>
<a href="http://organicconsumers.org/rbghlink.html" target="_blank">http://organicconsumers.org/rbghlink.html</a>
<a href="http://users.westnet.gr/~cgian/rbst.htm" target="_blank">http://users.westnet.gr/~cgian/rbst.htm</a>

Regards, Chip

[ November 18, 2002: Message edited by: Chip ]

MortalWombat · 11-19-2002, 04:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Chip:
Here are some other URLs some of which report information that appears to confirm the citation you have attempted to discredit.

I'm not discrediting the citation, I'm saying that Larsen seems to have misrepresented one of the papers that he cited. He claims that the paper showed that "oral ingestion of IGF-1 produced a significant increase in the growth of a group of male rats", while failing to mention that one of the conclusions of the paper was "oral toxicity studies have shown that bovine IGF-I lacks oral activity in rats." In addition, he fails to mention the main conclusion of the paper which is:
"On the basis of estimates of the amount of protein absorbed intact in humans and the concentration of IGF-I in cow's milk during rbGH treatment, biologically significant levels of intact IGF-I would not be absorbed."

In my book, that's misrepresentation.

11-07-2002, 05:57 PM	#1
Chip Banned Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 382	Remember, Everybody Heeds Bilk Bovine growth hormone, hmmmm, more milk, more money, more cancer? <a href="http://vvv.com/healthnews/milk.html" target="_blank">http://vvv.com/healthnews/milk.html</a> Take care, Chip Edited to fix graphics URL. [ November 07, 2002: Message edited by: Chip ]</p>

11-18-2002, 03:33 PM	#9
Chip Banned Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 382	"This Hans Larsen guy seems to be misrepresenting the findings in at least one of the articles that he cites." Difficult to come to that conclusion from just an abstract. Here are some other URLs some of which report information that appears to confirm the citation you have attempted to discredit. <a href="http://www.home.intekom.com/tm_info/rw80626.htm#Monsanto�s" target="_blank">http://www.home.intekom.com/tm_info/rw80626.htm#Monsanto�s</a> <a href="http://www.vegsource.com/articles/breast_cancer.htm" target="_blank">http://www.vegsource.com/articles/breast_cancer.htm</a> <a href="http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/john.rose/rbgh.html" target="_blank">http://www.argonet.co.uk/users/john.rose/rbgh.html</a> <a href="http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1527/rbghlink.html" target="_blank">http://www.geocities.com/Athens/1527/rbghlink.html</a> <a href="http://nofany.org/hottopics/bovinegrowthhormone.html" target="_blank">http://nofany.org/hottopics/bovinegrowthhormone.html</a> <a href="http://www.parkc.org/GeneticEngCancer.htm" target="_blank">http://www.parkc.org/GeneticEngCancer.htm</a> <a href="http://www.transnationale.org/anglais/sources/alimentation/hormones__rgbh_cancer_hazard.htm" target="_blank">http://www.transnationale.org/anglais/sources/alimentation/hormones__rgbh_cancer_hazard.htm</a> <a href="http://www.foodsafetynow.org/info.asp?cam_id=57" target="_blank">http://www.foodsafetynow.org/info.asp?cam_id=57</a> <a href="http://www.healthcoalition.ca/bgh.pdf" target="_blank">http://www.healthcoalition.ca/bgh.pdf</a> <a href="http://organicconsumers.org/rbghlink.html" target="_blank">http://organicconsumers.org/rbghlink.html</a> <a href="http://users.westnet.gr/~cgian/rbst.htm" target="_blank">http://users.westnet.gr/~cgian/rbst.htm</a> Regards, Chip [ November 18, 2002: Message edited by: Chip ]</p>

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11-08-2002, 11:59 PM	#4
MadMordigan Beloved Deceased Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 2,704	Be wary of ascribing to malice what can be explained by stupdity.

11-09-2002, 06:20 AM	#5
Chip Banned Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 382	Take a look at the advertisements on your TV, in newspapers, in magazines, on radio. The vast majority of these present lies meant to get people to buy things based on misinformation. Conspiracy is very common and allowed. Based on my own research of second-order cybernetics, the science of control systems as pertains to sociology, I came to the same conclusion as Lysander Spooner championed at the close of the US civil war. Nations, and most institutions, are basically fraudulent enterprises, conspiracies to preserve priveleges for a few at the expense of many, <a href="http://www.mind-trek.com/reports/cona.htm" target="_blank">http://www.mind-trek.com/reports/cona.htm</a> Here's another URL regarding Bovine Growth Hormone <a href="http://www.organicconsumers.org/rbgh/akrepart1.cfm" target="_blank">http://www.organicconsumers.org/rbgh/akrepart1.cfm</a> If Monsanto just made a mistake that they find too painful to admit, then they are going to great pains to avoid that mistake becoming common knowledge. Check out Monsanto's court sanctioned outrageousness proceeding in Canada regarding genetically modified corn <a href="http://www.percyschmeiser.com/" target="_blank">http://www.percyschmeiser.com/</a> I know it is not a happy thought that conspiracy to take advantage of people's ignorance and trust appears widespread but there is intelligence in not disregarding this possibility when the evidence is so apparent. Regards, Chip

11-18-2002, 10:23 AM	#6
Chip Banned Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Earth Posts: 382	BTW, my family uses Horizon brand dairy products which does not contain BVGH. Ben and Jerry have strongly voiced their opposition to BVGH and claim that they haven't and will not use such tainted milk in their ice cream products. Regards, Chip

11-18-2002, 11:39 AM	#7
lisarea Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Broomfield, Colorado, USA Posts: 5,550	Well, if I may gloat for a moment here, I simply chose from among the many local milk delivery companies a small, family run farm that pledges to never use BGH. And they deliver it in thick glass bottles, too, with a slab of ice on top to keep it cold.

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