Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Badfish · 05-01-2003, 04:25 PM

Ahhh but not even Satan is an atheist, he is a full blown believer.

Badfish · 05-01-2003, 04:27 PM

And he stands in judgement and is getting thrown into the lake of fire.

Bye Bye Satan :wave:

Yes he did rebel against God, he is the accuser, and he is a fallen angel who was given dominion over the earth until Christs return.

Proctors_Gambit · 05-01-2003, 04:31 PM

You say that very easily badfish but can you explain why an all knowing god would have created satan?
And why of all the places he could have sent him (the center of the sun for example) he decides to send him to Earth to rule over his apparently beloved creation?

-Gambit

Grad Student Humanist · 05-01-2003, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marduck
"That entire story is extra-biblical and I have no idea how it entered Xtian mythology."

No, a lot of this is in Revelations, a truly odd book.

In the OT Satan is an angel, he is not rebellious, he is an accuser, he tests people on behalf of his boss. As in Job.
Only following orders.

I've never read Revelations because I just don't care. But I thought it described a vision of the end of the world. Does it have a flashback section that explains the fall of Satan which must have taken place sometime before the stuff in the Garden of Eden with the snake and the fruit?

(Now I know that the original Jewish interpretation of the Genesis story does not in any way include Satan. The snake is just a snake. But the Xtian myths indicate that Satan was the one who tempted Eve so he must have rebelled and fallen before 99% of the events in the Bible took place).

Marduk · 05-02-2003, 09:13 AM

"I've never read Revelations because I just don't care. But I thought it described a vision of the end of the world. "

Yes, that's in there to. It starts out as a letter to one of the Early Christian churches, than the drugs kick into full gear and things get weirder and weirder, right down the old rabbithole and through the looking glass.
The arch angel Michael battles Satan and boots him out of Heaven. It is worth the read. A good piece of literature regardless of your beliefs, fine imagery, great sci-fi or fantasy/mythology stuff.

Grad Student Humanist · 05-02-2003, 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marduck
"I've never read Revelations because I just don't care. But I thought it described a vision of the end of the world. "

Yes, that's in there to. It starts out as a letter to one of the Early Christian churches, than the drugs kick into full gear and things get weirder and weirder, right down the old rabbithole and through the looking glass.
The arch angel Michael battles Satan and boots him out of Heaven. It is worth the read. A good piece of literature regardless of your beliefs, fine imagery, great sci-fi or fantasy/mythology stuff.

Well I'll get to it eventually. Maybe. Right now I'm busy reading Flannery O'Connor and Alan Moore who I would wager to be much better writers that whoever the hell wrote the Book of Revelation.

Badfish · 05-02-2003, 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Proctors_Gambit
You say that very easily badfish but can you explain why an all knowing god would have created satan?
And why of all the places he could have sent him (the center of the sun for example) he decides to send him to Earth to rule over his apparently beloved creation?

-Gambit

Yes, God created Lucifer as his most beautiful highly regarded Angel, and gave the angels freewill, well Lucifer thought he was more powerful than God, and rebelled against him, there was a struggle and Satan and 1/3 of the angels that backed Satan were cast out of heaven.

God hasn't destroyed him yet because he is going to be the scapegoat, and a lesson to everything that embodies God, when he defeats Satan and casts him into the lake of fire.

This show will be grand, and will be a spectacle of God's sovereignity. The righteous and unrighteous will behold this, unfortunately the unbelievers will be cast into the lake with him.

Badfish · 05-02-2003, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Grad Student Humanist
I've never read Revelations because I just don't care. But I thought it described a vision of the end of the world. Does it have a flashback section that explains the fall of Satan which must have taken place sometime before the stuff in the Garden of Eden with the snake and the fruit?

(Now I know that the original Jewish interpretation of the Genesis story does not in any way include Satan. The snake is just a snake. But the Xtian myths indicate that Satan was the one who tempted Eve so he must have rebelled and fallen before 99% of the events in the Bible took place).

Then how can you take an educated stance against the existence of God? Is this closed mindedness of the worst kind?

Spaz · 05-02-2003, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Badfish
Yes, God created Lucifer as his most beautiful highly regarded Angel, and gave the angels freewill, well Lucifer thought he was more powerful than God, and rebelled against him, there was a struggle and Satan and 1/3 of the angels that backed Satan were cast out of heaven.

Well that shows how good God's judgement is eh?

Quote:

This show will be grand, and will be a spectacle of God's sovereignity. The righteous and unrighteous will behold this, unfortunately the unbelievers will be cast into the lake with him.

Well shit, at least there'll be nice fireworks before I get cast in.

You are one crazy crazy man, but at least you're consistent

sakrilege · 05-02-2003, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by marduck
"That entire story is extra-biblical and I have no idea how it entered Xtian mythology."

No, a lot of this is in Revelations, a truly odd book.

In the OT Satan is an angel, he is not rebellious, he is an accuser, he tests people on behalf of his boss. As in Job.
Only following orders.

Who was it that tempted jesus in the desert? And didn't jesus mention satan at other times?

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05-01-2003, 04:25 PM	#11
Badfish Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Death Valley, CA Posts: 1,738	Ahhh but not even Satan is an atheist, he is a full blown believer.

05-01-2003, 04:27 PM	#12
Badfish Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: Death Valley, CA Posts: 1,738	And he stands in judgement and is getting thrown into the lake of fire. Bye Bye Satan :wave: Yes he did rebel against God, he is the accuser, and he is a fallen angel who was given dominion over the earth until Christs return.

05-01-2003, 04:31 PM	#13
Proctors_Gambit Regular Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Australia Posts: 372	You say that very easily badfish but can you explain why an all knowing god would have created satan? And why of all the places he could have sent him (the center of the sun for example) he decides to send him to Earth to rule over his apparently beloved creation? -Gambit

05-02-2003, 09:13 AM	#15
Marduk Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2000 Location: the 10th planet Posts: 5,065	"I've never read Revelations because I just don't care. But I thought it described a vision of the end of the world. " Yes, that's in there to. It starts out as a letter to one of the Early Christian churches, than the drugs kick into full gear and things get weirder and weirder, right down the old rabbithole and through the looking glass. The arch angel Michael battles Satan and boots him out of Heaven. It is worth the read. A good piece of literature regardless of your beliefs, fine imagery, great sci-fi or fantasy/mythology stuff.

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