Freethought & Rationalism Archive

Godless Dave · 04-08-2003, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mike_decock
Did they break with the earlier tradition or build on it?

Tomato, tom-ah-to. They changed the earlier tradition, that's for sure. A lot of Catholicism came about by grafting Christianity onto the Roman state religion. The title Pontifex Maximus (highest priest, the pope's formal title) was around even before Christ was born, as was the hierarchical structure of the priesthood.

mike_decock · 04-08-2003, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Godless Dave
Tomato, tom-ah-to. They changed the earlier tradition, that's for sure. A lot of Catholicism came about by grafting Christianity onto the Roman state religion. The title Pontifex Maximus (highest priest, the pope's formal title) was around even before Christ was born, as was the hierarchical structure of the priesthood.

I wasn't so much thinking about the hierarchical structure (which is as old as organized religion) but whether they broke with traditional Christian doctrine.

The Nicene Council was assembled to settle the disputes between the many Christian cults that had evolved during the first 3 centuries but I have seen very little regarding HOW they determined what was correct doctrine.

-Mike...

Captain Howdy · 04-08-2003, 10:55 PM

On what there is to do in heaven...

Well I'd like to take the outlook of George Bernard Shaw in his play 'Man and Superman" Heaven entertains those who will be entertained by the heavenliness of heaven... and likewise with hell. Those who are suited for hell are bored in heaven, and those suited for heaven are bored by hell. But I'd don't believe in either, I just sort of liked the idea, and man and superman is a great play.

On the legitimacy of the different christian sects
It is obvious that the "TRUE" christians broke away from the catholics. Being an ex catholic (not by choice of course, but I was a few weeks old, i couldn't say anything when the bastards baptized me) I know my church history. Bible Basis my ass, all you've got is Martin Luther and henry VIII blowing their tops. The entire "FREE WORLD" agreed that catholicism was the "one true religion" at one point in time.

And finally, on your mentality
What is wrong with you my friend? Parmesan or Oregano, it's still cheese! What you are doing wrong is preaching to who don't give half a damn what brand of milk either of the sects dish out. Do you not understand? This is a Secular board, it's even called 'internet infidels' WE DON'T CARE why that religious branch is as good or as bad as you say it is because it is in our opinion that you are spouting bullshit, ( as they are) and we would like you both just to please shut the hell up. We all have our reasons for disbelieving what the both of you say. and until someone gives us damn good reason, we're not going to budge. ( directed to magus55, spurly, all christian sects, and the catholic church)

Thank you, I hope I am speaking for the atheists and the agnostics here.

Verithrax · 04-11-2003, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Radorth

The part we created after obtaining "the knowledge of good and evil" is sick and disgusting, and headed for self-extinction. And I'm sure there will be plenty of Christians around to witness it.

Rad

Yeah, either we all kill each other, or we're headed towards a nice, clean, Star Trek-like future. Either way there will be christians to spoil all the fun.

Birdsmgp · 04-11-2003, 01:14 PM

Wasn't this Thread about: "What is there to do in Heaven?"

...OH!?! Rest At last! I'm going to miss that splendar that I always wanted. But anyway. It just might be like this?

... And I saw something as such: "There isn't a Refund, if God doesn't wake us up." (From? I forget.)

theIPU · 04-13-2003, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
What are you talking about? Hell isn't described much until the New Testament. You are questioning its existence based on the old.

Rev 19:20 And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.

Rev 20:10 And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Rev 20:14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.

Rev 20:15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Rev 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

The Lake of Fire is what Christians casually refer to as Hell ( since its more well known concept), but Hell and the Lake of fire are two separate places. Kinda hard to mistake the above quotes and misunderstand hell. Lake of fire, thrown in alive, tormented day and night for ever. Where is the confusion?

The confusion is that an omnibenevolent and omnipotent god would let that happen

winstonjen · 04-13-2003, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by theIPU
The confusion is that an omnibenevolent and omnipotent god would let that happen

Don't you get it by now?!?! The Xians clearly define omnibenevolent as kind to THEM for all eternity!! Praise! I'm gonna convert!

Magus55 · 04-13-2003, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by theIPU
The confusion is that an omnibenevolent and omnipotent god would let that happen

For him not to let it happen would make Him unbenevolent and non omnipotent, because He would be forcing people to be with Him, when they don't want to or He would be letting them dictate how He judges them, which violates His sovereignty. Sin is an eternal crime, deserving of death. For Him not to punish it eternally, would make Him unrighteous. The problem is you are trying to grasp the concept of Sin and justice from societies standard. A crime done to society, doesn't even come close to a crime against God. Its apples and oranges, and you can't base one on the other.

P.S. Omnibenevolent isn't even a word

winstonjen · 04-13-2003, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Magus55
For him not to let it happen would make Him unbenevolent and non omnipotent, because He would be forcing people to be with Him, when they don't want to or He would letting them dictate how He judges them, which violates His sovereignty. Sin is an eternal crime, deserving of death. For Him not to punish it eternally, would make Him unrighteous. The problem is you are trying to grasp the concept of Sin and justice from societies standard. A crime done to society, doesn't even come close to a crime against God. Its apples and oranges, and you can't base one on the other.

You're saying that god can't go against his nature. I say that whatever people or deities do, DEFINES their nature. If you disagree, please explain. A thing's nature can change over time.

Magus55 · 04-13-2003, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by winstonjen
You're saying that god can't go against his nature. I say that whatever people or deities do, DEFINES their nature. If you disagree, please explain. A thing's nature can change over time.

Can you become non human? Does your human nature change over time? No, maybe your feelings, emotions, ideals etc. but you can never not be human, just like God can never not be righteous, just, good, loving, omnipotent, omniscient etc. Those traits are to God, as human is to you. God is never changing, He is now as He has been for all eternity, and always will be.

04-08-2003, 10:55 PM	#183
Captain Howdy Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Manila, Philippines Posts: 562	Let me give my two cents worth... On what there is to do in heaven... Well I'd like to take the outlook of George Bernard Shaw in his play 'Man and Superman" Heaven entertains those who will be entertained by the heavenliness of heaven... and likewise with hell. Those who are suited for hell are bored in heaven, and those suited for heaven are bored by hell. But I'd don't believe in either, I just sort of liked the idea, and man and superman is a great play. On the legitimacy of the different christian sects It is obvious that the "TRUE" christians broke away from the catholics. Being an ex catholic (not by choice of course, but I was a few weeks old, i couldn't say anything when the bastards baptized me) I know my church history. Bible Basis my ass, all you've got is Martin Luther and henry VIII blowing their tops. The entire "FREE WORLD" agreed that catholicism was the "one true religion" at one point in time. And finally, on your mentality What is wrong with you my friend? Parmesan or Oregano, it's still cheese! What you are doing wrong is preaching to who don't give half a damn what brand of milk either of the sects dish out. Do you not understand? This is a Secular board, it's even called 'internet infidels' WE DON'T CARE why that religious branch is as good or as bad as you say it is because it is in our opinion that you are spouting bullshit, ( as they are) and we would like you both just to please shut the hell up. We all have our reasons for disbelieving what the both of you say. and until someone gives us damn good reason, we're not going to budge. ( directed to magus55, spurly, all christian sects, and the catholic church) Thank you, I hope I am speaking for the atheists and the agnostics here.

04-11-2003, 01:14 PM	#185
Birdsmgp Regular Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Aberdeen, Washington Posts: 434	What is there to do in Heaven? Wasn't this Thread about: "What is there to do in Heaven?" ...OH!?! Rest At last! I'm going to miss that splendar that I always wanted. But anyway. It just might be like this? ... And I saw something as such: "There isn't a Refund, if God doesn't wake us up." (From? I forget.)

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version	Search this Thread: Advanced Search

Freethought & Rationalism Archive

The archives are read only.