DMB

I am sick to the stomach at all the horrible abuses of human rights perpetrated by the Shari'a. Here is <a href="http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,3-389123,00.html" target="_blank">yet another example.</a>

Until fairly recently, Nigeria had a normal legal system. Now they have this obscenity in the muslim North. Those of us living in the comfortable West need to speak up in defence of human rights.

Born Free

I'm with you DMB, what can we do to help??? It sickens me too that things like that can still be even thought about in the 21st cent.

Alonzo Fyfe

My sentiments are the same.

It particularly bothers me that somebody will likely die as a result of this stupidity.

About the only activity we can engage in is protest.

Three items that come immediately to mind are:

(1) Press releases from any and all atheist organizations (even local organizations) denouncing this barbarianism.

(2) Have signs/posters made up showing some of these victims and showing those signs at the Godless March.

(3) Having these people mentioned somewhere in the speaking portion of the March.

But I would be more than welcome to hear other suggestions.

Autonemesis

no good

[ August 20, 2002: Message edited by: Kind Bud ]</p>

crazyfingers

Wouldn't that international treaty of the Rights of women and children that Bush refused to sign because of pressure from the religious right have had something to say about this? Not sure but I suppose Nigeria didn't signed it either.



[ August 20, 2002: Message edited by: crazyfingers ]</p>

excreationist

I don't really think 2 and 3 are a good idea... it would seem that atheists hate religion and are using the examples of overseas extremists to criticize religion in general...
I think the focus could be more about the positive ideals of humanism rather than focusing too much on the bad sides of religion. Though a bit of the bad bits of religion could be touched on...

gilly54

When I read this article yesterday, my first thought was BRING ON THE DNA PATERNITY TEST!! When the father is caught in his lie, then what?

I've tried to understand the allure of this religion but it is as odious, violent and ridiculous as Judeo/Christianity in my opinion. Let's hope that in the two years that this poor woman has been given to live, reason, compassion, and international condemnation, specifically condemnation from other Muslim countries, like those buggars in Saudi Arabia, prevail.

[ August 20, 2002: Message edited by: gilly54 ]</p>

Krieger

I wonder what the "compassionate conservative" Shrub administration will say about this (if anything).

Sickening reactionaries.

Alonzo Fyfe

I'm not quite sure about that. I think that if we point out an abuse that most theists agree is an abuse then it cause them to acknowledge that there are limits beyond which religion ought not to be taken.

Besides, people at the march will be complaining about having "under God" in the pledge and "In God We Trust" on the money, and creationism in the schools.

In a context where these wrongs can and will be mentioned, I believe that the even greater wrong such as the stoning of these young women can be used to better communicate a main point. That religion is find if taken in moderation, but barbaric when fundamentalists ae allowed to take it to an extreme.

Ultimately, I am opposed to a general blanket attack on religion not because it is suppressing a truth for the sake of public acceptance. I think that general attacks on religion are wrong. We all know -- well, I do at least -- decent theists, and when we cast stones aimed at all theists we do a disservice to those who practice their religion peacefully.

These are our allies in the political arena, in addition to our friends, family, and neighbors, and we should not be insulting them.

But at the same time I see no merit in remaining quiet about true abuse simply because we might anger the abusers. We should not be afraid to say, "Here, you have crossed the line. When you make In God We Trust the motto of a nation that is supposed to include those who do not believe in God, you have crossed the line. When you set up a ritual to intimidate children into pledging allegiance to your God, you have crossed the line. When you hijack airplanes and crash them into skyscrapers, you have crossed the line. When you stone a young woman to death for the crime of adultery, you have crossed the line."

We should be clear that we think that there is a line, beyond which religion ought not cross.

Yet, if this is a concern, then perhaps it should be put into context. Pick a positive message and put it beside the negative message.

4th Generation Atheist

Actually I think this is an example of the kind of "criticism of religion" we could use, b/c it's really more a criticsm of state-sanctioned religion-based law than of religion per se. No one is criticizing these Muslims for believing in Allah; the criticism is of course directed to the harsh criminal sentence meted out by a government that has let a religious organization possess it. Not only is this case a criticism that American theists of various stripes have likely already heard of and agree with, it's a fair warning concerning what the marchers---nontheists and theist supporters---don't want to see in any society. What we want to avoid for the march is criticism of belief, of the "God is stupid" variety, which we feel comfortable venting here and in our homes but not at a large public event.

To get back to the main thrust of the thread, this makes me think of that "when they came for..." quote. One normally interprets that quote to refer to events in one's own country, but in the age of globalization we have to get used to keeping an eye out for human rights violations everywhere. It's true that the U.S. shouldn't be setting itself up as everyone's guardian, but that doesn't mean that the human race can't act that way. I'm glad to see people speaking out about this around the world.